Ducati Sporting Club UK > Model Specific - Discussion, Technical Problems and Help > 998 / 996 / 916 / 748 > Question on lights

[Vlud]

What would you guys suggest for aftermarket lighting? I find that my stock bulbs in my 996S really suck at night, and would like to get way more outta the headlights.

[neil748r]

You can fit real gas discharge lights. Haven't done it myself but have read plenty of very positive reports from those that have. These guys seem to have a very good rep and they're UK based: http://www.hid-online.com You retain the stock headlamps and fit a modified bulb/lamp assembly to them. The kits come with everything you need including bike specific wiring harness, igniter etc etc.

[Edited on 7-4-2004 by neil748r]

[Shazaam!]

Better Headlights

The headlights on your Ducati are the result of a number of design compromises and legal restrictions. So, before you go changing them let me list a few points to consider first.

The light patterns of high and low beams are legally restricted, because otherwise the light from oncoming vehicles can blind you and you can blind them. So reflectors and bulbs are designed in combination such that there is a sharp cut-off to the light pattern to prevent this glare.

The color of the our headlight beam affects our ability to see. The more yellow and less blue the beam, the better we can SEE WITH IT at night. The more blue and less yellow the beam, the better it can be SEEN during the day. This is a function of the way our eyes work.

The brightness of the headlight increases as the electrical current through the bulb is increased. Bulbs with a higher wattage rating are brighter. But, given that the heat and electrical demands on the charging system and wiring increase with higher wattage bulbs, 55 watt bulbs have become standard on most vehicles.

You can't get something for nothing. Some headlight bulb manufacturers advertise getting the equivalent of 85 watts of light while consuming only the standard 55 watts of electrical power. They do this trick by concentrating the light beam more at the center and less at the edges so you can't see objects to the side as well.

True high intensity discharge (HID) lighting systems are more efficient than halogen gas-filled bulbs so for the same wattage used they produce a brighter light. But, they're also bluer in color. These expensive systems first appeared on high-end luxury cars that use a government-mandated self-leveling system to avoid blinding oncoming traffic. It's illegal to fit these lights to your car without the leveling devices for a good reason.

The blue-colored light from true HID's has created some confusion in the marketplace that is being exploited by headlight bulb manufacturers. True HID's use an entirely different arc-discharge (like a movie projector) technology to produce their brighter light, but because the resultant light is bluer (higher degrees Kelvin) buyers naturally think that blue light is brighter so they switch to blue bulbs in an attempt to get brighter lights.

To add to the confusion, the term HID is often seen on packaging of standard halogen bulbs that have simply been given a blue dye coating. The coating absorbs light so they may be bluer but they're NOT AS BRIGHT as the same bulb without the coating.

Short of a true HID system there IS a better bulb available (if it's not blue) that increases the usable light output by pressurizing the bulb with a higher percentage of the gas Xenon. The BmwXenon 30% Xenon bulbs for example, use this technology.

http://www.bmwxenon.com/ducati.html


Ducati Superbike HID Lighting

I installed a HID lighting system in place of the high beam halogen bulb in my Ducati 916.

The system I used was from Baja Designs but I don't see it on their current website (http://www.bajadesigns.com/).

Actually, any manufacturer that uses a separate igniter modile like the one shown will here probably work.




Some recent designs use an integrated bulb/igniter that could have clearance problems with the headlight casting opening.




Here's a picture of my installation:





The stock Ducati high beam bulb mounting plate needed to be modified with a Dremel to accept the larger diameter HID arc capsule. All HID systems are single (arc) bulbs so they not dual function high/low beams. However, they are three times brighter than a regular high beam (1290 vs. 3200 lumens) so all you really need is the HID alone. My beam pattern is very good with no hot spots or scatter.

Here's a picture comparison of the 55W low beam and the 35W HID high beam using the same exposure.




The principal reason I installed it is to be more visible to traffic and to reduce electrical load on my system (35 W vs. 55 W). Night vision is vastly improved but I really don't ride at night much. The light color is bluer but not like the blue lights you buy in auto stores. They're the same as the Mercedes, BMWs and Lexus HID lights that come from the factory and shouldn't present any legal difficulties.

The basic limitation on a HID conversion is that there are no HID arc capsules that have a transverse (side-to-side) arc path. They're all front-to-back.




This picture shows a H1 bulb on the left with the ruler's top edge passing through the center of the wound filament. On the right is the HID arc capsule with the ruler's top edge passing through its center. Note that in order to place the HID arc center correctly at the focal plane of the headlight reflector, the distance from the base (near the lower edge of the ruler) is the same distance as for the H1.

So you can only convert an H1 bulb (or an H4 high/low bulb.) Otherwise the light pattern is all screwed-up because the arc isn't placed at the focal point. The superbike low beam is a H3 projector-type unit so it can't be converted.

The problem is that a H3 bulb has a transverse (left-to-right) filament that sits at the focal plane of the optics. If you move the filament out of the lens focal plane it screws-up the light pattern creating hot spots and glare to oncoming traffic. So, if you put a HID front-to-back arc in the low beam fixture, the major part of the arc that runs forward and behind the focal plane cannot be focused and the light pattern is nonsensical for good night vision and preventing glare to oncoming traffic.

[Vlud]

Wow, thanks for the info guys, I've learned alot about the lighting of cycles now . I was just comparing my Ducati's lighting to my GSXR's I've had and it is such a difference its just sad. The Ducati is a lot harder to see at night with. I've heard a lot about the new Sylvania bulbs that came out and i guess my friends that have put them in bikes/cars are very happy with them, but of course, around here i'm the only one with a Ducati, so I'm not sure if they work as good. Guess i'll buy some and let ya guys know how they work, if they dont work good, only lost 56 US dollars, but if they work great, worth every penny i guess.

[nick_gr]

Originally Posted by Shazaam!

So you can only convert an H1 bulb (or an H4 high/low bulb.) Otherwise the light pattern is all screwed-up because the arc isn't placed at the focal point. The superbike low beam is a H3 projector-type unit so it can't be converted.

I am looking to get a Xenon kit for my 999 also, but I have gotten confused along the way.

Shazaam, taking what you say in consideration you can fit a Xenon kit only if you have H1 or H4 bulbs. So I had a look at my 999's manual and it states that the Headlight bulbs are H4. So far so good.

However, I was under the impression that an H4 bulbs has two fillaments inside -one for dip and one for main beam. If that is the case, then why does the bike have two seperate bulbs -one for dip and one for main??
Have I got it all wrong?

What is the right kit to get? On hids4u website it mentions that the H4 type vehicles should fit the "bixenon" system -does that mean that it has two xenon chambers/bulbs in one???

Also the kits I have found so far are very expensive (from 350 to 500 euro). Any chance of finding something a bit more economical? Some mates have fitted xenon kits with 200 euro with 2 ballasts+bulbs.

[nick_gr]

So, in summary what would be the best kit to buy (taking into account the price of course)?

I know that the digital one from Xetronic is the best bet, but it is also rather pricey.

So excluding that, what you think is the best bet?

- Motorcyle HID kit from xenondepot (200 USD)
- Visionpro kit from xenonking (170 USD)
- HID kit from cqlight (90 USD)
- Bosch (?) kit from ebay (115 USD)


What do you reckon? Anyone have any of the abovementioned kits? Are you happy with them?
I must admit I quite like the Bosch kit, but only 115 USD for 2 Bosch balasts + bulbs? Seems a little cheap isn't it?
Other than that the cqlight one seems nice also and it is dirt cheap (but this raises one's suspicions also....)

EDIT: I found this and thought that it would be interesting for everyone:

http://autoworld.com.my/forum/allpos...Fake+Bosch+HID

http://www.autoworld.com.my/forum/al...ject=Bosch+HID

http://hid.com.my/forum/viewtopic.ph...fc0c94ec70cc70

[Shazaam!]

Here in the USA, Ducati 999 have H3 bulbs in both the high and low beam projector-type light units. So, like the H3 low beams in the earlier superbike models they can’t be replaced with a HID element without getting an unacceptable light pattern. The H3 bulb has a transverse (side-to-side) filament but earlier HIDs had only a longitudinal (front-to-back) element suitable only for H1 low beam reflector-type lights.

H4 bulbs have two longitudinal filaments located at different distances from the base so they have different focal plane distances. The light optics (usually reflector-type) are then designed around the two filament positions to get the correct light pattern at both high and low beam positions.

So the UK 999 lights are different than the ones sent over here? This surprises me since projector-type lights used on the 999 are usually designed around a single filament and used as the high beam or low beam only. Certainly the right-left dip direction is different here but that doesn’t account for the difference.

Note: A quick search finds only HB3 lights listed for the French, German, and Italian 999s. Double-check your manual.

[nick_gr]

Shazaam what do you mean by unacceptable pattern? BTW I don't live in the UK, I live in Greece, and our beam direction is I guess the same as in the US.

So far I have come to the following conclusions:

- The kits with the Bosch logo are fake. They are generic ballasts made by a Chinese company (and I would steer WELL clear of any chinese products).

- Other kits I've seen on the market are using the same ballast, only branded differently. However, users are quite happy with their performance. That been said, I would be wary of the whole system catching on fire, being of Chinese origin (not being racist - just that I've seen it happen on MANY chinese products)

- CQ Light seems to be using a different ballast + invertor, but I don't know how good these are performance wise.

- McCullogh is good, however they are a bit more expensive than the others.

- Also Xetronic is the best option but the cost is really high.

PS. Double checked the manual: Indeed it says Headlamp type: H4
(but they must obviously have it wrong, as H4 is double fillament bulb)

[Shazaam!]

More info:

http://www.danielsternlighting.com/t...nversions.html

http://www.danielsternlighting.com/t...dvantages.html