Ducati Sporting Club UK > DesmoDue Race Series > DesmoDue - General Questions and Chat > New regs for 2010

[WeeJohnyB]

cheap racing Ant

I'm thinking more like it should have had mirrors at sometime in it's life

Serious point though, the best ride on an RS will win, but the average rider on the RS will still be average - see point well made above re Class B bike winning a Class A race. I have been on track on my 748e and not been beaten on power by a 748r purely because of line and corner exit speed. I've ridden around the outside of a lot of 996R's in my time on my CB500. A well known story exists of a certain Monty on his ST4 with panniers on it riding around me on my 748 at Silverstone on one of my first trackdays.....never again old man

I ride with some of the No Limits instructors and can't believe what they can do with a motorbike compared to my crappy skills

WeeJohnyB

[MLC Racing]

[quote=WeeJohnyB] The never-ending saga that is tyres in DD

The word safety is raised above and has been many times before and no doubt will be again. How can you tell me that it is 'safe' to ask a rider to ride to their limit and beyond in race conditions on a road tyre on a cold and wet March morning with no tyre warmers. Any racer will tell you it's madness, most wouldn't go out under such circumstances. In my first year in CB5's, wets were not allowed, but warmers were. I am by comparison to some of my lunatic competitors a fairly smooth rider, so I actually enjoyed the wet races on dry tyres as I knew I could beat others I normally wouldn't and that some of them would fall off. I have watched DD'ers tip toe around a corner in the wet and sat at The Hairpin and the Mountain at Cadwell watching good riders fall off and take others out with them.
What price 'cheap' racing when your bike is in bits, the guy next to you in the paddock's season is over because you took him out and you are sitting in a hospital bed - all for the cost of a set of warmers or wets.

QUOTE]

I have made this point before as well but we appear to be in the minority.

And if people feel there is no benefit in the use of tyre warmers why ban them?
I have no problem with the Pirelli's or the single tyre rule.
But it would be nice if at Pembrey at the end of September, they were up to temp. before the chequered flag.
Where people source them from is their own affair. Having Mark at Holbeach's services trackside is great and one thing less for me to worry about.


My concerns about a 748/9 class is that it has been done in SS600 or SOT or some other class that is not 'Ducati'. and it goes even further away from the 'cheap racing' phylosophy that fills the class B grid while the enthusiam for class A (Gucci) seems to be dwindling away.

[paynep]

You can always tell autumn is here - the nights start drawing in, the leaves start turning brown and the great DD tyre mass debate begins again.

[Imola Duke]

I got to grips this year with pushing it on the first lap and got over my cold tyre phobia

Sticky stuff did have HR Diablos for £134 free postage back in March.
They soon rocketed up in price when i posted a link on here......
Maybe Pirelli had a word.........

Just had a set of Maxxis Sports fitted to my 944 SS for £135 (fitted) at Bikers world whats good enough for
Guy Martin is good enough for me!

[MLC Racing]

Originally Posted by paynep

You can always tell autumn is here - the nights start drawing in, the leaves start turning brown and the great DD tyre mass debate begins again.

Some people mass debate through all 4 seasons

[Chris Wood]

Anyone else like soup? Pea and ham for me!

My 748rs isn't going anywhere near you nut jobs on track!!!

[faith-healer]

Originally Posted by Imola Duke

....Sticky stuff did have HR Diablos for £134 free postage back in March.
They soon rocketed up in price when i posted a link on here......
Maybe Pirelli had a word.........

They were almost certainly given 'the hard word' Steve. I have a source for Diablos at £143 fitted to loose wheels. I said I would put a link on here and was asked not to as If I did supplies would probably "Dry Up"

I told a few people in the paddock and I know Phil (Ghost) got a pair mail order for about the same.

Originally Posted by ChrisBushell

I am afraid that you have this wrong. It is not about a monopoly of supply (no one has insisted that you buy your tyres from Holbeech and I confirmed that I could order them from my local supplier on a 48hr basis this morning) it is about the tyres being used being "fit for purpose".

We have previously been informed by Pirelli (and I reconfirmed this at the begining of this season) that the Class A bikes (our most powerful) do not have enough power or weight to work the ZR tyre hard enough to get them up to operating temperature for safe racing under the conditions that we operate under at New Era events.

If the bikes had more than 90bhp and weiged more than 175kgs, then they would be recommending the ZR rated tyre - we do not meet either criteria.

Hopefully that will put this to bed once and for all.

It's not likely Chris....My supplier disputes the statement from Pirelli "Z rated were not suitable" as once they have started to warm up they retained that heat better due to the difference in construction (see Andy Shep's post). They also said that compounds had changed over the last few years and the Z's were now slighly softer and are fit for use ....for both classes.

Their recommended treaded, control tyre for DD, wet and dry, class A and B is the new Michelin Pilot One (soft front medium soft rear )

The company is owned by the most experienced race tyre supplier in the UK; and will be subject to the same liabilty issues that you have spoken of in the past.

....I was also told with Michelin now putting much of their MotoGP budget into club and national racing an early letter to Michelin UK 'could' get a very satisfactory result for all DD'ers.

BTW....You still owe Steve Klee (Imola Duke) 'a public apology' on here and on Ducatisti

One more thing....If you owned an tatty 1985 Ford Escort and wanted to buy a new car would you spend all your time trying to source a 'new' 1985 Ford Escort or buy an up to date, safer, more economical, comforable....get the picture

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by ChrisBushell

You are entitled to your opinion of course, but I am afraid that your argument is flawed.

Both of the series that you mention do not run a road based control tyre. I understand they have the option to run wets so their tyre performance in colder/wet conditions is not an issue.

I have spoken to the Pirelli representative this morning and they have confirmed that the reason for the recommendation of the use of the HR rated tyre is to do with cold/wet weather running. In cold/wet weather with lower track temperatures an HR rated tyre will run at operating temperature apreciably more quickly than a ZR rated tyre, given the weight and performance of the bikes to which they are fitted - equally they will cope with dry hot conditions without any problems.

The suggestion is that an HR tyre will get to proper operating temperature in a couple of laps max - you can push it from the race start - on a ZR tyre you might need 2-3 racing laps to get them up to temperature on a cold/wet day and that has safety implications, after all you are racing from the moment the lights go out - who would wait for their tyres to get up to temperature?

Can we have a name for this Pirelli representative? As I have been unable to find anyone in Pirelli who will commit to such a comment.

[Chris Wood]

I'd like to know who shot JFK?

[paynep]

Does the whole Z or H rated issue become a bit of a non-issue as MY supplier - Micheldever Tyres - has advised me that their supplier tells them the "Pirelli don't make the H-rated Diablo anymore"?

Maybe we have to consider the use of a different tyre or manufacturer for 2010..............oh, hang on, I appear to have fallen through a wormhole in time....