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  #11  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 16:59
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Originally posted by ChrisBushell
The licence thing will not apply to you Tony as your Australian years count. The only people this affects is those under 20 of which I do not expect many.

Woohoo!

Thanks for clearing that up Chris.
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  #12  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 17:21
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Tony,

My pleasure!

Steve,

Please see the post I have just put up on the other thread, but as this is a means of moving up from track days to racing, lets keep some control on it. As the father of a 17 year old who knows no fear, there is no way that I want to be out on track with that type of holigan, if I am just getting into racing for the 1st time or in my case after about 25 years of the track.
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  #13  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 17:59
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Originally posted by ChrisBushell

1) Eligable bikes

The primary requirement is for us to acheive at least 25 bikes to take to a grid. At the moment if the majority of entrants wish to use only 583cc carbed models, then we dont have a problem. As long as we acheive our numbers

If we need to include 620cc fuel injected ones to make up numbers, then we need to allow the 583cc ones to have a big-bore kit or run two classes. I will be able to confirm the two classes within the grid once we have seen the ACU at end of the month.

Chris
Is the preffered plan to have 2 classes? Or by allowing 600s to run big-bores would this mean a single class (if you allowed 620s)?

If I can run either a 600 or 620 in the same class, then the 620 would be my choice, but not if you don't include them in the first place. If I was to go for a 600, then I'd have no plans to fit a big bore kit or similar to a 600, as if I was to compete, it would really be a "tape the lights up, fill up the tank and go" type approach (well maybe a bit more, but you take my point, certainly no engine mods) and I wouldn;t want to be overly dissadvantaged from the off if I was not to run the later 620 model.

I understand that the final rules have yet to be defined, and appreciate that he rules will allow 600s to be overbored so that riders on these can have similar power, but I think that the quicker the rules are finalised the better.

If I can run a 620 I'll get one of them, if I can't, I'll get a 600 - Will you allow 620s???

Allowing us to have input in to these rules is appreciated, but probably makes your job more difficult rather than easier.. I appreciate all your efforts with this and wouldn't want your job!!!!

Thanks
Tim

[Edited on 11-10-2004 by Rattler]
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  #14  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:17
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Tim,

Neil & I worked these rules out on the basis that the 620 does have a significant advantage over the 583 to the tune of about 25% in power terms, mainly I think as it has a better head and injection.

In view of that we assumed that most people would like to try with a 620, but that they might not want the necessary commitment (£3k) to purchase one. As there is a large pool of 600 Monsters out there, that appear to be available from £1500 upwards, how could we get them on a level playing field. The perceived wisdom was to allow over bores, which should get them within 2-3bhp of each other.

My current view is that it would be better to be inclusive rather than exclusive and allow both engines, overbores on 583sfor those that want to and both types of bike (Monster & SS).

If the worst comes to the worst then we could always have 3 sections to the results :

1) 583 std

2) 674 overbores on 583s

3) 620 injected

That way as the years go by and as the 583s come to the end of their usefull life, there can be a gradual transition to the 620 engine for people, again they should be getting cheaper.

If we can keep people with 5hp of each other, by dynoing the bikes at a time the organsers see fit (but not announced to the competitors) to police the 70hp limit, then in all reality rider ability and weight is going to have a bigger impact than the type of bikes ridden.

Remember the aim here is to allow people to get into racing (which is inheritantly expensive) whilst controling the costs involved. Mainly you shouldn't be able to exercise ones cheque book and gain a signifant advantage over the guy who spends a lot of time sorting out his bike.

Chris
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  #15  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:24
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Why a 674cc limit?
Why not make it 680,there is already all the stuff to do this in the Monster DP catalogue.
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  #16  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:32
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The Ducati Performance over bore kit gives you 674cc not 680cc.

Sorry we had already worked that one out, but perhaps not communicated it effectively.

Chris
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  #17  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:38
KeefyB KeefyB is offline
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Ah,thanks for that.
The catalogue says its a 680 kit.They speak with forked tongue methinks!
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  #18  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:39
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Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisBushell
Remember the aim here is to allow people to get into racing (which is inheritantly expensive) whilst controling the costs involved. Mainly you shouldn't be able to exercise ones cheque book and gain a signifant advantage over the guy who spends a lot of time sorting out his bike.

Chris

In that case, as I have said from the start of these threads, why not make it a series for bog standard carby 600's. Full stop.

SS or Monster, it wouldn't matter, but what you would do by doing that is.

1) Remove the possibility of people simply being able to flash the cheque book and spend twice as much on the bike to get the extra ponies of a newer 620ie

2) Remove the need for carby 583 owners to spend shed loads on big bore kits

3) Get the base cost of the bike as low as possible and just about even stevens for everyone

4) Remove the ambiguity and make the race preparation down to lockwire and catch tanks

After that, if it was real cheap racing you're after, make everyone run on one set of standard road tyres per meeting (wet or dry), and make those road tyres something like Bridgestone 020's so that they last half a season (and so that richer folks gain no advantage by being able to run the stickiest gumball Metzlers and a set of wets)
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  #19  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:42
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Jools,

have to say I dont have a problem with any of your comments, the oonly proviso being that at least 25 people need to sign up and get their deposits down for std 600 (583cc) racing, with control tyres.

Please start letting me know which way you boys want to go.

Chris
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  #20  
Old 11-Oct-2004, 18:46
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Cheers Chris...

I don't want to bang on about it but...there's already posts about the price of a 680 kit (which turns out to be an actual displacement of 673.8)...

It's £800. I rest my case.
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