Ducati Sporting Club UK > DesmoDue Race Series > DesmoDue - General Questions and Chat > New regs for 2010

[ChrisBushell]

Originally Posted by skidlids

Here are some of the dates of last years process

Version 1 First draft 22/10/08
version 2 second go 3/11/08
Version 3 Third attempt 25/11/08
Version 3.1 5/12/08
Version 3.2 19/12/08

The reason for the March date is that the DD rule book also incorporates rules from the ACU handbook and this is not issued until Feb/March time
Ideally next years versions will cut these out, such things as number and background sizes and Noise limits
The Phase "to comply with current ACU regulations" should surfice

Kev,

No reason why those dates aren't achievable.

Chris

[antonye]

From reading on the boards, it seems that the issue of CDI boxes (specifically the status of the Ducati Performance CDI units) needs to be addressed.

Given that the series aim is to keep it as cheap as possible and the cost of those things, I personally think they should be specifically excluded and locked to the standard part specified by oem part number.

If people are already running them then there looks like a buoyant market for them on ebay, so selling them on and replacing with standard units shouldn't be a problem?

My worry is that if this rule is left untouched or removed (ie, not made more specific) then it could open things up to custom CDI boxes and more expense - and that's the preserve of the Class A bikes!

Does that seem sensible?

I agree with Kev and Chris that the rule changes MUST be released as soon as possible. There's no reason why we can't have a review of the rules for this year and any problems with them that have arisen over this season and make some suggested amendments before the end of Oct as suggested. This gives time to discuss/vote/whatever before locking down early in the new year. Any changes that come out of the ACU rules are not going to be specific enough to warrant any kind of major headaches with either Class A or B.

[Andy C]

So the question is, does anything need changing? In my view no! Tyres seem to be a problem but i'm sure a phone call made by the right person would sort that. The RC could then issue a set of rules and all entrants must also abide with the ACU rules. Can't see a problem. If you don't like em, don't race in that series! But i forgot we've then gotta spend the next 5 months arguing about wether the tyres are any good, blah blah blah. Someone make the rules, lets build our bikes to them and go and race! And it could all be sorted by Christmas!

Originally Posted by skidlids

Here are some of the dates of last years process

Version 1 First draft 22/10/08
version 2 second go 3/11/08
Version 3 Third attempt 25/11/08
Version 3.1 5/12/08
Version 3.2 19/12/08

The reason for the March date is that the DD rule book also incorporates rules from the ACU handbook and this is not issued until Feb/March time
Ideally next years versions will cut these out, such things as number and background sizes and Noise limits
The Phase "to comply with current ACU regulations" should surfice

[MLC Racing]

Originally Posted by Chaz

I think you are a bit out of touch with engine blow ups Chris! Sam west has blown at least 2 & a couple of 620 have let go, having said that in general they are very reliable.

No reason why they shouldn't be still racing in fifty years time plenty of bikes that age still on track that are no were near as good as our little Desmos.

If the cause of the engine failures was due to over-revving then perhaps excluding non-original ignition boxes might help engine life.

It appears to me that at the moment Class B is more buoyant than Class A and that perhaps a phasing out of the current class A bikes for a new formula may be the way forward.

Given the success of standard Class B engines of whatever age, would a 900ss class with no mods other than cans and suspension give the more commited racers a class with the 'prestige' and performance they need without loosing the DD character. Keeping mods to a minimum would also keep the budget racing tag.
I'm not an expert but need 900ss's be more expensive to maintain than 600ss's.

I can see the 696 Monster as the alternative to this but initial outlay may still be prohibitive whilst 900ss's seem to be fairly cheap and easy to come by.

At one time on this forum a std. 748 class was muted as a possibility also!

[Ray]

Originally Posted by MLC Racing

At one time on this forum a std. 748 class was muted as a possibility also!

Purely from a spectators point of view that would look good IMHO.

Foggie lookie likies V Corser V Chili V Whitham V Reynolds V Mackenzie V Xaus V Casoli V Easton V Bostrom V Hodgeson V Toseland V Walker V Emmet V Hislop V Bayliss.....

aaahhh the nostalgia

Good many bikes about at a reasonable price.

Ray

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by Andy C

So the question is, does anything need changing? In my view no! Tyres seem to be a problem but i'm sure a phone call made by the right person would sort that. The RC could then issue a set of rules and all entrants must also abide with the ACU rules. Can't see a problem. If you don't like em, don't race in that series! But i forgot we've then gotta spend the next 5 months arguing about wether the tyres are any good, blah blah blah. Someone make the rules, lets build our bikes to them and go and race! And it could all be sorted by Christmas!

Andy the problem with the tyres is the availability, one company appears to have the monopoly on supply.

Lets go ZR and they are available from anywhere.

[skidlids]

Originally Posted by Andy C

So the question is, does anything need changing? In my view no!

Possibly a few things need changing

Entrants were saying they were unable to buy new Standard pistons. i'm not sure if this applies to all 583s or just the older pre 99 ones, ie bikes between 11 and 15 years old (they have got 5 years older over the years DD has been running)
Sam west and Dallas seem to get along fine with the newer 1999 to 2001 engines and spares may be more readily available for these 8 to 10 year old engines

So is the lack of availability of new piston for Class B bikes an issue that needs to be researched and alternatives looked at, If so this takes time

Igniter Box's such as AL-9000s ban there use or allow them and come up with wording that stops people using igniters that have programable advance curves.
Is the current rule a gray area of are people just bending the existing rule to suit them.

Rider eligability for Class B, I have heard several comments this year refering to how long some Class B riders have been campaigning in that Class and how they should move on.
Again is this a issue with the majority or a minority

[ChrisBushell]

Originally Posted by Ghost

Andy the problem with the tyres is the availability, one company appears to have the monopoly on supply.

Lets go ZR and they are available from anywhere.

The problem with the ZR rated tyre is that Pirelli have specifically stated that the bikes are not heavy enought and dont have enough power to get them up to required operating temperatures and as such wont endorse them for the series.

That is not the case for the HR rated tyre.

This is important because it is the racers necks on the line with this and saftey is important.

Supply of the HR rated Rosso shouldn't be a problem next year, as I currently understand it.

Before anyone starts on it I am not aware of any good reason to move away from Pirelli tyres!

[ChrisBushell]

Originally Posted by MLC Racing

I can see the 696 Monster as the alternative to this but initial outlay may still be prohibitive whilst 900ss's seem to be fairly cheap and easy to come by.

At one time on this forum a std. 748 class was muted as a possibility also!

In part I was suggesting the 696 from the point of view that it is a current bike, as the 620 was when we started 5 years ago!

The 900s haven't been in production from proabaly 6/7 years now and I dont know what parts supply is like. What we do have is a question of power in that my old one was good for 75bhp on the road, probably more on the track. I think that Pirelli would be looking at Diablo 3s and wets for that sort of power - big increase in cost, etc. Also what happens when it is ****ing down and someone trys to go out on Diablo 3s - that could get dangerous?

4 valve race series is a possibility, we looked at thing in 2006/7. Biggest thing is cost control, even if you used Superstock/proddy racing rules and how do you stop cheating to obtain power - all very difficult and would need a lot of protests to keep a lid on it.

If we were to look at a 4 valve series it would require 25 people to commit up front and I suppose we would look at the 749 rather than the 748 to keep it reasonably current.

[skidlids]

Originally Posted by ChrisBushell

Supply of the HR rated Rosso shouldn't be a problem next year, as I currently understand it.

Although on the Pirelli.com website there is still no mention of H rated Rosso's
And I do find it strange tha Pirelli endorsed the use of Z rated tyres in 2005 and 2006 for the Desmo Due series if they now deem them unsuitable