Ducati Sporting Club UK
DesmoDue - General Questions and Chat
Discussions on the race series devised and supported by the DSC.
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 13-May-2009, 15:53
Rattler's Avatar
Rattler Rattler is offline
Registered Forum User
WSB Hero
 
Posts: 8,863
Join Date: May 2002
Mood: www.cantbearsed.co.uk
Or how about converting the 620s to 583s?
Quote+Reply
  #22  
Old 13-May-2009, 15:54
paynep's Avatar
DSC Member paynep paynep is offline
DSC Club Member
Ducati Meccanica
 
Posts: 2,081
Join Date: Jun 2001
Mood: Wet wet wet
Didn't Ducati make a big bore kit for the 600 ??







I'll get my coat


Paul

15th year in DD #68 and getting slower by the year

1199, SS800 & 620SSie DD racer
Quote+Reply
  #23  
Old 13-May-2009, 16:00
paynep's Avatar
DSC Member paynep paynep is offline
DSC Club Member
Ducati Meccanica
 
Posts: 2,081
Join Date: Jun 2001
Mood: Wet wet wet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rattler
Or how about converting the 620s to 583s?

As I read the rules there's nothing stopping anyone running a carbed 620 in Class A.

Except somehow you have got to make the sparks happen. The flywheels are different so you can't use the 583 pickup setup, and a pair of CDI boxes are almost as expensive as a new ECU.

Unless you use a 750ss ie loom and ECU for the sparks and a set of flat-slides for the fuel...........hmmm

Anyone got a set of 35mm flatsides spare?


Paul

15th year in DD #68 and getting slower by the year

1199, SS800 & 620SSie DD racer
Quote+Reply
  #24  
Old 13-May-2009, 16:28
Fastfasulli Fastfasulli is offline
Registered Forum User
500SD
 
Posts: 675
Join Date: Dec 2005
750 conversions sounding a bit fanciful then. So...i'll ask my original question again:

Is Class A DEAD, not tired or shagged out or just restin?
Quote+Reply
  #25  
Old 13-May-2009, 16:37
Rattler's Avatar
Rattler Rattler is offline
Registered Forum User
WSB Hero
 
Posts: 8,863
Join Date: May 2002
Mood: www.cantbearsed.co.uk
Quote:
Originally Posted by paynep
As I read the rules there's nothing stopping anyone running a carbed 620 in Class A.

Except somehow you have got to make the sparks happen. The flywheels are different so you can't use the 583 pickup setup, and a pair of CDI boxes are almost as expensive as a new ECU.

Unless you use a 750ss ie loom and ECU for the sparks and a set of flat-slides for the fuel...........hmmm

Anyone got a set of 35mm flatsides spare?

SSSSTTTTTOOOOOPPPPPP !!!!!! Move away!!! Actually you've managed to get a 620 to perform like a 583 by just fuggin around with it - leave it alone, walk away from the tool kit.
Quote+Reply
  #26  
Old 13-May-2009, 16:59
skidlids's Avatar
DSC Region Organiser skidlids skidlids is offline
MotoGP God
 
Posts: 18,274
Join Date: Apr 2002
Mood: Its ONLY a Bike Club
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rattler
Actually you've managed to get a 620 to perform like a 583 by just fuggin around with it

I've managed that as well, but hopefully things will now be a bit different, I'll soon find out at Snetterton if I can't get it dyno'd before then.
Still got to remake a coil mount and try fitting the 998 PC3 USB, before it goes anywhere but i'm hopeful I have improved on the 55bhp I had at Donington.

Like Paul p I went the route of converting what was basically my 583 Class B bike to a 620, but as I could not get any life out of it when fitted with the 620s original clocks, ECU and coded keys I opted for the 750SSie ECU route without realising some of the pit falls, after all my 583 had been so easy to sort out, getting 51.5bhp at the rear wheel and like Paul P netting a few Class B podiums. Since going the DIY 620 route we have both struggled to match the performance we acheived on our 583s.
Some times I wish I hadn't switched class as Class B was more fun from where I was sitting

Take Pembrey
2005 - NG Minitwins 583DD bike on Pirelli Super Corsas - 1m 10s lap
2007 - NG Minitwins 750SSie on Pirelli Super Corsas - 1m 08s lap
2008 - DD races Class A 620 Diablo Control tyre 1m 14s lap

and I'm certain its not the Diablo that was costing me 4 secs a lap over my 583, I was expecting at least 1m 10s on Diablos.


Checkout the Desmo Due Paddock on Facebook
Quote+Reply
  #27  
Old 13-May-2009, 18:11
Rattler's Avatar
Rattler Rattler is offline
Registered Forum User
WSB Hero
 
Posts: 8,863
Join Date: May 2002
Mood: www.cantbearsed.co.uk
Quote:
Originally Posted by skidlids
I've managed that as well, but hopefully things will now be a bit different, I'll soon find out at Snetterton if I can't get it dyno'd before then.
Still got to remake a coil mount and try fitting the 998 PC3 USB, before it goes anywhere but i'm hopeful I have improved on the 55bhp I had at Donington.

Like Paul p I went the route of converting what was basically my 583 Class B bike to a 620, but as I could not get any life out of it when fitted with the 620s original clocks, ECU and coded keys I opted for the 750SSie ECU route without realising some of the pit falls, after all my 583 had been so easy to sort out, getting 51.5bhp at the rear wheel and like Paul P netting a few Class B podiums. Since going the DIY 620 route we have both struggled to match the performance we acheived on our 583s.
Some times I wish I hadn't switched class as Class B was more fun from where I was sitting

Take Pembrey
2005 - NG Minitwins 583DD bike on Pirelli Super Corsas - 1m 10s lap
2007 - NG Minitwins 750SSie on Pirelli Super Corsas - 1m 08s lap
2008 - DD races Class A 620 Diablo Control tyre 1m 14s lap

and I'm certain its not the Diablo that was costing me 4 secs a lap over my 583, I was expecting at least 1m 10s on Diablos.

Hmmm, there aren't too many who have switched from 583 to 620 and matched their previous results though. It deffo took Andy S a while to adapt, Chris W, Phil H didn't match their results initially, obviously the exam paper is somewhat harder (in terms of competition), but not sure about how much better their lap times were either?

I've not ridden a 583 at all, so no expert here, but as a discussion point, does the fact that the throttle on a 583 can be wound fully on before a 620 one could (by normal riders like us) give riders more confidence to go faster? As its one less thing to worry about? Maybe it just tales time?

I remember a test day at Snett, when I was matching / catching a quickish GSX600 rider (racer) on corner speed around bombhole-corum on my ol' 620 and whilst it wasn't all full-throttle for me, it was nowhere near for him, he had decision to make on throttle opening and I didn't really, and I closed on him.

Gawd nose!!! - but Jimbers seems to have found his DD mojo since mounting a 583, I reckon he would go faster on a 583 than a 620????

When Lily's not crashing , she says her laptimes on a DD bike compare closely to those on her 998. Familiarity, or fear of the unknown? :dunno:

So is it fear of the awesome power, torque and drive of a 620 over a 583?

Or is it that that they weigh a ton? Or is it just to have a little bit more power means you have to be a little bit more cautious?

Or perhaps there's less to fug about with on a 583 and hence the tinkerers like you and Payne can really mess up a 620 !!!! and slow it down.


The answer? Only go near it to ride it..........and if it aint broke.......!!!
Quote+Reply
  #28  
Old 13-May-2009, 18:46
paynep's Avatar
DSC Member paynep paynep is offline
DSC Club Member
Ducati Meccanica
 
Posts: 2,081
Join Date: Jun 2001
Mood: Wet wet wet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rattler

Or perhaps there's less to fug about with on a 583 and hence the tinkerers like you and Payne can really mess up a 620 !!!! and slow it down.




Oh I don't know, I recall changing the jetting to match the weather conditions at Castle Combe - and subsequently won the race!

I think that there is definitely some truth in the "flat out on a 583 but not quite sure when to nail the 620" theory. Possibly its easier if you have only ridden one or t'other, with the exception of the honorable Andy Shep?

Class A - Not Dead, Resting or Retired - just Puzzled

PS Franco - can I borrow my old 583 back please??!!


Paul

15th year in DD #68 and getting slower by the year

1199, SS800 & 620SSie DD racer
Quote+Reply
  #29  
Old 13-May-2009, 19:06
Rattler's Avatar
Rattler Rattler is offline
Registered Forum User
WSB Hero
 
Posts: 8,863
Join Date: May 2002
Mood: www.cantbearsed.co.uk
Quote:
Originally Posted by paynep
Oh I don't know, I recall changing the jetting to match the weather conditions at Castle Combe - and subsequently won the race!


Surely you'd planned to change the fork springs, raise the rear, check the squish, remove a disk, mod the timing, swap the engine, replace the loom and get it dyno'd between qually and the race, - you must've been tight for time???

Most people might take a set of spare wheels/tyres on a foreign trackday, you the only one I've known to take a spare set of forks!!!
Quote+Reply
  #30  
Old 13-May-2009, 19:31
ak47's Avatar
ak47 ak47 is offline
Registered Forum User
Big Twin
Bikes: KTM Arsey Ocho
 
Posts: 1,105
Join Date: Oct 2004
Mood: retiring
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rattler
Surely you'd planned to change the fork springs, raise the rear, check the squish, remove a disk, mod the timing, swap the engine, replace the loom and get it dyno'd between qually and the race, - you must've been tight for time???

Most people might take a set of spare wheels/tyres on a foreign trackday, you the only one I've known to take a spare set of forks!!!

There were days when he'd have a spare bike....
"Hmm... not fast enough....I'll try the yellow one"
Quote+Reply
Reply
  
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Postbit Selector
Switch to Vertical postbit Use Vertical Postbit

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Recent Posts - Contact Us - DSC Home - Archive - Top
Powered by vBulletin 3.5.4 - Copyright © 2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. - © Ducati Sporting Club UK - All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:31.