Best value mods for 748S? (which give greatest return for cost)

[ducatimad]

Rearsets
Race Temis
Slipper Clutch
Carbon bodywork
Ohlins rear
Ohlins forks
Engine blueprint/gassflow
853 conversion
Lightweight wheels
Professional Suspension setup

[Jon]

I disagree weeksy. Ohlins forks, shockand damper together make a vast improvment over std. Ok you don't have to buy ohlins you can have the showa with ohlins internals but don't ya just love that gold colour. Lighter wheels allow you to turn much quicker. Slipper cltch a must for track days, Termie's, no duke should be seen or heard without them, rear sets allow you to set them up to your own leg lenght etc and also give better ground clearence. Its only when you have all of the above and then try a bike which is std that you realise what a difference they make.:sing:

[skidlids]

Mods to my race bike for track use are

Rearsets
Race 54mm Exhaust system
Slipper Clutch from 748R
Carbon airbox, Seat and front gaurd, fibreglass fairing
Ohlins rear shock
reworked forks
Lightweight wheels
Quick change rear sprocket carrier
Brembo Radial front Master cylinder
My own Suspension setup

Mods to my road bike

Carbon Termis,
not alot else required for british roads, but saying that the race bike would make a stonking road bike

Most wanted bit. Magnesium longer swing arm

[Felix]

Have to agree with weeksy. Value for money, the suspension settings are the one to go for. The other one not on the list is a couple days of a track school like CSS.

Of course, Ducatimad didn't say which value he wants for his money. Going faster, smoother, or just a trick looking bike.

[skidlids]

So Slipper Clutch users like Hodgson, Byrne, Emmett, Rutter, Bayliss, Toseland, Reynolds, Capirossi, ROSSI, Bevan etc to name but a few are all incompetant.
I wouldn't say that myself, but then the faster you go the less time/distance you have to fit in the down changes

[Rattler]

.....it depends what you're trying to gain with the mods.

If its looks/pose value; - termis, carbon etc - fill your boots!!

If its performance, then you'll probably want to firstly brake and control her better, so; - slipper, mag wheels, race brakes, susp setup etc... then termis, filter etc to make her go faster.

But for me, the best use of the cash would be the CSS or European Superbike School....what you'll gain from this will allow you to maximise what you already have, rather than buying hardware to cover your limitations.

To draw and analogy;
As a golfer, I see lots of high-handicap players spend a fortune on new clubs and equipment that will reduce the errors in their game, but will not make them better players. It'll make their scores look better, because they make fewer errors, such as OOB etc, but they will not really improve as players.

But in order for them to become better players, they need to take lessons and practice these, its as simple as that. You can just practice and play a lot you will slowly improve, but you could be just be practicing the wrong things. Its also cheaper to take lessons than buy the latest Girlaway, Ti, fuel injected, fluid filled, carbon driver!!!

Some of the CSS and ESS type schools are very expensive, but equally there are smaller, less well known teaching schools that will provide valuable teachings and insight into riding better.

What the CSS gave me was bags of confidence (yes Dibble - until I binned it), I reckon that you'll get this from all reputable race schools..

Tim

[Edited on 5-7-2003 by Rattler]

[skidlids]

It depends what your using the bike for, if racing and flying into the Pembrey hairpin say and knocking down 3 gears from when you start braking, it gives both your engine and final drive a easier time if you have a slipper clutch, probably why Ducati fit them as standard on 748R's, RS's etc. On the other hand if road riding (DSC rideout etc) then no you don't need one, which is why my road bike has very few mods.
Its just like tyres a decent rider on normal road rubber, will go round Mallory in less than a minute, with no need for slicks, Super Corsa's , D207GP's and a like, which is like saying most riders using sticky rubber on trackdays etc and not getting within say 4-5 secs of the Supersport lap record are using such tyres to cover the incompetence of a poor rider, not to mention the use of tyre warmers on trackdays. But I would still consider fitting track rubber a sound investment.

After all what do you really need to ride fast on the track, all Paul Lewis needs is his Harley Davidson and is still waiting for somebody to take up his challenge for a race around Mallory.

As for pro suspension set-up, I'm happy enough doing my own, so its not on my list and I can't be doing a bad job of it as within 2 practice sessions at the IOM TT with neither myself or Adrian having ever raced a R6 before, managed to have it lapping at over 110mph and got it good enough to take a untuned bike to 21st in the Junior TT.

[KJ]

I would say that the only two mods worth doing to a stock bike are -

Techtronics Quickshifter
Slipper Clutch

Sublime-semi-automatic-no-brains-fullthrottle-quite-safe-ducati-lunacy!

Bound to bring a smile to your face!

KJ

[Dazza]

Wheels, forged Mag Marchi's to be precisie, the 10 spoke ones.
Best 'enhancement' I've spent my money on so far.
Only thing I havent bought yet are Ohlins R/T Forks.......

[DJ Tera]

Have to agree with Dazza, the 10-spoke mags are awesome! So much quicker turning in above 100mph:roll:

[DJ Tera]

Forgot to say Tecmoto did a good deal on mine!:sing:

[Haley]

I would have to agree with weeksy on the full set up for rideability and Dazza and DJ with the wheels for looks ......................hmmm just gotta save up :D

[998Addict]

As you guys know, I started racing this year. At the start of the season, I was adamant that, to my already well-prepped 916, I needed:

1. Lightweight wheels
2. Slipper clutch

When I say adamant, I mean bricking myself at the thought of racing without getting them.

So on I went, and £1,300 later said bike is looking like the best thing in the paddock - but did it make me go any better? Did it hell!

The top and bottom of it, guys, and I bet I'll get flamed for this, is that very few of us will ever truly explore the limits of the 748/916/996/998 package through anything other than incompetence. If you don't believe me, just take a standard bike and give it to someone who can actually ride - you will not believe it. Like slinging their leg over anything from a GSX-R to a KTM, they will take many seconds off your laptime, without the benefit of thousands of pounds in bolt-on goodies. One of the instructors at Croft regularly joins the Fast Group on a CB500 (yes, one of those!) and laps in the low 1:40s/high 1:30s, which is Sound of Thunder race pace. Its about skill, not how much you want to bolt-on.

THAT SAID, if you want to spend money making your bike look more pose-worthy, or just better in your own eyes, then there's NOTHING AT ALL WRONG WITH THAT - just don't kid yourselves that spending money on any Ducati bolt-on goody will make you a faster rider. It may make you feel more comfortable (better brakes, etc.) but when it comes down to it, there's no substitute for learning to ride better, as I'm now finding out the hard way.

[adam]

could'nt have been said better, a talented rider will storm round a track on what ever bike quicker than most of us if not all. I have spent quite a bit of cash on goodies knowing it was the looks first then any benefit it may give, though the PFM brakes i added were better than the ones on my 748r, much smoother.
We buy our bikes for it's looks, nothing compares to a Ducati. People buy exhausts for that little increase in power, right, can they use all the power there already? NO. Those termis look good and sound good, simple as that.

DJ, mags let you turn in quicker at 100 miles an hour, hum, remember the CSS, you push that bar enough and that bike will turn in quick even with pram wheels.
As previously said schools will help above anything else.

[muttsnuts]

Rider training at a school like CSS - its cheap, will make you faster, safer and it costs you nothing to change bikes in the future, very cost effective.

Oh and Weeksy, I agree with you as well - what a bugger eh - its just isn't your week is it !

Did you get the leathers back anyway ?

[skidlids]

I find some of the comments a bit disturbing, is it being said that riders who can not lap as fast on there bike as some one like Hodgson, Toesland or Shakey would on the same bike are all incompetent. If any of them were happy to take my bike to its limit and feel safe in doing so I would consider that I had done a fairly competent job of putting it togeather. The fact that I can't ride it at their sort of pace is mainly due to a lack of skill/talentl, coupled with a lack of fitness, agression and a good dose of self preservation (old enough to know better)following to many hospital stays.
I race for fun, quite often attending meetings by myself in excess of 160 miles from home and crashing is not something I want to do, although it does happen on the rare occassion. To help me stay upright and get to the chequered flag I try to put the best bike I can out on the grid, knowing that I will reach my limits well before the bike does, put my mate Adrian on it and he will be near the front of the field in any club race, stick the 955 Corse engine in it and he would probably be on the podium. Last Year I raced a TL1000S which certainly had more power and speed than my 916 and took me to finishes in the top 5 and in every race I entered on it I was always the first TL1000S home, maybe some of this was because of the Ohlins shock, the reworked forks, the braced swingarm, rearsets and my own setting up of the bike. So how this quallifies myself and others like me as incompetent I don't know.
Maybe i should try slicks which would extend futher the limits of the bike, but at my level I am happy enough on Rennsports and super corsas or Wets.
I could go on but thats enough for now.
As the best value is the parts you've paid for and don't regret spending the money.

[998Addict]

Skidlids -
Fair comments, my friend.

The point I was trying (and evidently failing) to make is one you make at the end of your post, about "the best value is the parts you've paid for and don't regret spending the money".

A TL1000 is well documented to be an ill-handling bike, and so I'm not surprised that adding Öhlins suspension, alternative linkages, etc. would provide a big benefit. I was actually referring specifically to the 748/916/996/998 package, and the benefits that most of us (me included, and if I have inadvertently included you in that generalisation, I apologise) really can get from upgrading things like Öhlins suspension, slipper clutches, lighter wheels and the like.

I also make the point that making these upgrades in order to make your bike merely look better or sound better is absolutely understandable, and something I poured a lot of money into before I started racing.

No offence intended.

[Edited on 10-7-2003 by 998Addict]

[DJ Tera]

Originally posted by adam
DJ, mags let you turn in quicker at 100 miles an hour, hum, remember the CSS, you push that bar enough and that bike will turn in quick even with pram wheels.
As previously said schools will help above anything else.

Pram wheels would turn-in even quicker mate :lol:
I'll let you take my bike out for a spin some time and you can tell me whether you think the 600 quid was worth it or not :D

[ducatimad]

Thanks all for your comments, as always some real interesting stuff.

I agree that as long as the bike is 'ok' and I think we'd all agree that the 748S is pretty ok in stock format, it's more about the standard of the rider than the wizzy bits or even the colour, though red is clearly faster than yellow of course!

I know that the main limiting factor is me and not my bike but I have been experiencing some 'rear end' problems especially in the wet at Mallory that I believe (and so do Sigma) would be resolved by a slipper clutch.

Hey, why not use the 'better' kit to help your 'less than brilliant' riding ability.

Keep on postin!!:roll: