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[andyb]

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DUCATI 999
" LOOK " " LOOK " " 999R " " LOOK " " LOOK " Item number: 4529702050

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Current bid: £4,100.00


Time left: 4 days
5-day listing, Ends 25-Feb-05 20:51:32 GMT
Start time: 20-Feb-05 20:51:32 GMT
History: 6 bids (£2,000.00 starting bid)
High bidder: aprilla_duk ( 6 )


Item location: GRAVESEND
United Kingdom

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cyclotron200 ( 32)
Feedback Score: 32
Positive Feedback: 100%
Member since 05-Oct-03 in United Kingdom

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Description Seller assumes all responsibility for listing this item.

YOU ARE BIDDING ON A DUCATI 999 R ! YES IT IS A "R" MODEL, HOWEVER ALL THE R PARTS HAVE BEEN REMOVED AND USED FOR RACING, THE PARTS REMOVED HAVE BEEN REPLACED BY STANDARD 999 PARTS, IT IS AN 03 BIKE AND HAS COVERED 2,800 MILES AND AS YOU CAN SEE LOOKS VERY NICE, THIS ALSO COMES WITH THE 999 R PLAQUE AND PRESENTATION CASE, THIS MOTORCYCLE IS NOT RECORDED AND IS H.P.I CLEAR. I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO END THE AUCTION AT ANY TIME.




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DUCATI 999
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[andyb]

Sorry i didnt know how else to post it. A "genuine 999r,!" thats had all the R bits removed??? If you look closely at the frame ithas the multiple foot peg adjustments......You only get two on a real R. Fake!!!!

[adam]

some poor sod might fall for it though, andy have you contacted the seller to see what they have to say? could be interesting.

[Rushjob]

Click here....... (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4529702050&indexURL=0&photoDisplayType=2#ebayphotohosting):P

[Edited on 21-2-2005 by Rushjob]

[GsxrAge]

well spotted mate :cool:


barstwerds :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[andyb]

I was hoping some of the more techno guys on here, who i know are good at sabotage would do that. Its about covering your trail!;)

[dave w]

R my Arse.....Thats one of them old grey framed models :D

[electricsheep]

Originally posted by andyb
I was hoping some of the more techno guys on here, who i know are good at sabotage would do that. Its about covering your trail!;)

Shame one of your workmates could not setup a sting

[Edited on 21-2-2005 by electricsheep]

[electricsheep]

Originally posted by Dseered
Does the 'r' not have a big tank ?

I think that's just the 749r

[Iconic944ss]

Good spot - this one is down to pure techical knowledge of the 999 series that I dont have (but I'd like to :) ).

Having said that - the guy appears to be 'reasonably' honest about the bike, he also has 100% feedback as well.

But.......with no reserve, if something looks to good to be true..................

Cheers - Frank

[ducv2]

Your slipping Frank:D:D:D

[andyb]

Thing is, is the identity on the sale the real seller or is it a case of id theft? Like iconic says he does look too good to be true.

[andyb]

Originally posted by electricsheep
Originally posted by Dseered
Does the 'r' not have a big tank ?

I think that's just the 749r

I think thats just the wannabee R :lol::lol:

[electricsheep]

I wonder where all the standard parts came from ?
It would cost more in parts that the cost of a 999r
Also what is he racing that has all the r parts

maybe he really did swap every part except the silver plate,
or maybe he just swapped the silver plate

[andyb]

Originally posted by dave w
R my Arse.....Thats one of them old grey framed models :D

Howcome the original 916 set the trend, then we put up with all the encarnations, 996 998 etc..... then when we get the original 999 the same doesnt apply? :lol::P:lol:

[jobr]

If you look at his feedback he sold a £700 ecu yesterday for £26quid and the buyer has left feedback already????????????????????????

Could one of the techy geniuses not post an interesting question so as to alert the unsuspecting?

[andyb]

I havnt reported it, dont just yet!

Looking at the 'seller's history i wonder if we could contact one of the persons that seller has done a deal with?

They may have exchanged email addresses or telephone numbers. Then we could speak with the genuine person prove hes had his id nicked and then................:puzzled:

[andyb]

Would the potential id thief have developed this scam as way back as dec 03? I doubt it. What about trying to contact that purchaser?

[Iconic944ss]

Since I know little of the 999 - it seems to me that this guy is trying to make out that a standard 999 was really a 999R originally and happens to have a 999R plaque and presentation case.

have I got this right?

Is it possible to recognise any parts as being from a 999R? It does not appear to have it written on the fairing etc.

Feedback - another good spot the ECU feedback is too soon unless the guy lives close and went and picked it up himself.

Logical route might be to email the bidders and warn them but....the the rooster might fly the coup !!!

Frank

[electricsheep]

I can not see any 999r parts. Everyting I can see is from a standard 999 BIP

I can't be certain about the frame.

BIP subframe
BIP seat unit
Front forks
Front Brakes
Fairings

All of these would be different on the R

[andyb]

The piccie appears to be a std 999 bip, there is nothing in the piccie to suggest 999r!

The whole suggestion of removing the R parts is so stupid it couldnt realistically be true.

If they were removed for racing, why not just use the whole bike. Whats left of the bike to call it an R?

The scam is so stupid to have drawn attention to themselves with the suggestion within the sale. You just wouldnt or couldnt do it! So why describe it as this? Why not just look to sell it as a std bike? The only answer i can think is for an appeal value, but then why not just stick a piccie up of a 999R ?

[andyb]

The giveaway is when you enlarge the picture. You can see the multiple holes on the bottom footpeg mount. A genuine R frame has just two for homologation.

[jobr]

Originally posted by andyb
The piccie appears to be a std 999 bip, there is nothing in the piccie to suggest 999r!

The whole suggestion of removing the R parts is so stupid it couldnt realistically be true.

If they were removed for racing, why not just use the whole bike. Whats left of the bike to call it an R?

The scam is so stupid to have drawn attention to themselves with the suggestion within the sale. You just wouldnt or couldnt do it! So why describe it as this? Why not just look to sell it as a std bike? The only answer i can think is for an appeal value, but then why not just stick a piccie up of a 999R ?

I suppose he is hoping somebody not clued up falls for it. If he put a picture of an R up the buyer would probably spot the difference on collection???

[Edited on 21-2-2005 by jobr]

[andyb]

Oh and the std grey headlamp. It is of course magnesium even on a lowly 03 bike.....and you dont need that for racing!!:D

[Iconic944ss]

So why not just say its a standard 999 - whatever the background ????

Have just Emailed the seller asking for more details.

Frank

[Iconic944ss]

Fast reply:

My Email.......

"Hi, I'm very confused by this auction - is it a 999 with the 'R' engine fitted or have ALL the 'R' part been taken off - in which case does it not need to be re-registered in some way? two final questions - do you have the HPI check papers and would it be possible to view at all please?"

The Reply........

"THE FRAME / CHASSIS SPEEDO AND ELECTRICS ARE ALL THAT IS LEFT OF THE 999 R THE REST WAS USED FOR RACING AS SAID, EVERY THING ELSE WAS REPLACED WITH STANDARD PARTS, THE REGISTRATION HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED BECAUSE IT IS STILL THE ORIGINAL ( R ) FRAME , SO THEREFORE IT IS THE SAME REG NUMBER, IT IS H.P.I CLEAR AND YES I DO HAVE THE COPY, YOU ARE WELCOME TO COME AND HAVE A LOOK."

I'm more confused than ever ????????????

Frank

[jobr]

Need somebody from kent to pop round and have a look.:frog:

[Glyn]

sounds like a build
from a frame that was never recorded as being wrote off

[andyb]

You can see here the multiple footrest mounts. This shows its not a 999r frame as they only have two!

[andyb]

two mount holes like this............

[jobr]

Good spot andyb, trouble is someone who isn't clued up is going to get well stung with this. Not that I would ever buy a vehicle of fleabay but I wouldn't know detail like you have just pointed out as I am sure many won't.

[Walenut]

Well it's certainly been over as the clutch cover is bent in. Its probably an unrecorded build up, which would explain the change in engine or frame numbers when hpi'd I think you'd do better asking him what class he raced in and some other racing technical questions.

[Walenut]

And if he races Ducati's surely he's seen DSC, he's got a computer!

[JasonBoswell]

have you seen the name of the highest bidder ?? :D

[andyb]

Have you seen his responses?

[stu-st4]

As already pointed out this seller has got a 32 rating with 100% feedback,
this is split more or less 50/50 as a buyer/seller. Prehaps this bloke just does not know what he is talking about (obvious I know) or what he has got, some one should point it out the technical errors in his description and see what he say's, I am quite happy to do this except I am not clued up on 999's. I also noticed he has been bidding on cars and car parts he may be a car dealer and may have taken the bike in as a part ex, and the racing story is just the one he was told.

[antonye]

Come on - any car dealer that takes a blind bit of notice of some guy's story without checking out the facts and knowing for definite what he's buying wouldn't last in the trade!

All car dealers will screw you for every last penny and know exactly the margins they're working on, and won't touch anything they don't know the exact price of.

It sounds more like a write-off & rebuild if you ask me.

[weeian]

LOL the highest bidders name is, "ITS A CON" hahaha.

/ian

[Harv748]

If he provides the engine No. then surely its one phone call to DUK to check if its a 'R' or not?

[weeian]

ask him that question and see what he says.
infact i think i will.
/ian

ok i sent him the question.
[Edited on 22-2-2005 by weeian]

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by weeian]

[rockhopper]

"Hi there. A quick question about the bike, the 999R doesnt have multiple holes on the bottom footpeg mount like your picture shows. A genuine R frame has just two for homologation purposes. So is the frame 999R or is it from another bike?"

HI, THANKS FOR THE EMAIL, I THINK YOU MAY BE SLIGHTLY WRONG THERE, THE LOGBOOK / FRAME NUMBERS ALL MATCH UP AND IT SAYS 999R, PERHAPS THERE IS MORE THAN ONE STYLE OF FRAME, I DON'T KNOW ? CHEERS

[JasonBoswell]

Originally posted by andyb
You can see here the multiple footrest mounts. This shows its not a 999r frame as they only have two!

To be fair, from your close up piccie I can only see two positions on his frame - the hangers are on the upper setting at the mo.

Still appears dodgy tho...

[weeian]

heres what he said

Hi there could you please provide the engine and frame number so i can veryfy this is an "R" model. Thanks alot !

Cooperlargo
HI, THANKS FOR THE EMAIL, I CANNOT GIVE YOU THE ENGINE NUMBER AS ALREADY SAID IN ADVERT THAT ALL " R " PARTS WERE REMOVED THE ONLY PART LEFT WAS THE FRAME AND SPEEDO / ELECTRICS ETC, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT I AM VERY WARY ABOUT GIVING CHASSIS / FRAME NUMBERS TO ANYBODY FOR OBVIOUS REASONS, BUT YOU ARE MOST WELCOME TO COME AND VIEW THE BIKE, BRING WHOEVER YOU LIKE GIVE IT A GOOD GOING OVER RUN ANY CHECKS YOU LIKE ETC, THIS IS A GENUINE SALE I'D LIKE TO THINK I'AM A GOOD GUY, PLEASE CHECK MY FEEDBACK IT SHOULD GIVE YOU A BIT OF AN IDEA OF HOW I AM, CHEERS

/ian

[Rocker]

I have just sent him the following question and await his reply

Hi I am quite interested in your bike however I am a bit puzzled as some of the frame details do not appear to tally with your statement that this is in fact an R model albeit with most of the R bits removed.Is it possible that you could give me the engine number so that I can assure myself that it is an R before bidding

[jobr]

If you look at the ebay page he has amended the description of the ad twice last night.

[Rocker]

I got the same reply to my question so asked him for the reg number so that I could carry out a HPI check.
This was his reply
HI, NO PROBLEM THE REG NUMBER IS WM03EKB HOPE THIS HELPS , CHEERS

[stu-st4]

I put in a similar question to the rest of you this is the answer I got,

HI , THANKS FOR THE EMAIL, I HAVE THE AUTHENTIC DUCATI 999R PLAQUE IT IS IN A RED LEATHER BOUND CASE THE FRAME NUMBER ON THE PLAQUE MATCHES THE NUMBER ON THE FRAME ITSELF, AS STATED ALL THE " R " PARTS WERE REMOVED FOR RACING EXCEPT THE FRAME , CLOCKS , ELECTRICS ETC AND REPLACED WITH STANDARD 999 PARTS THIS ALSO INCLUDES THE " R " ENGINE, YOU ARE MOST WELCOME TO COME AND VIEW THE BIKE BRING WHOEVER YOU LIKE GIVE IT A GOOD GOING OVER AND DO ANY CHECKS YOU LIKE, PLEASE HAVE A LOOK AT MY FEEDBACK I'D LIKE TO THINK IT GIVES YOU AN IDEA WHO YOU ARE DEALING WITH, CHEERS

:puzzled:

[Twinfan]

The 999R never came with anything other than a red frame. Why would you re-spray it grey and fit standard everything else? It just doesn't ad up! Someone should go and see it. Is anyone local?

[andyb]

Originally posted by Twinfan
The 999R never came with anything other than a red frame. Why would you re-spray it grey and fit standard everything else? It just doesn't ad up! Someone should go and see it. Is anyone local?

WOOOOOOOOOoo, easy tiger, the ORIGINAL 999r did indeeed come with a grey frame!;)

[Twinfan]

Did it? I stand corrected! It's not exactly an R if all that's left is the frame though, is it?? And why use the full carbon fairing for racing?

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by Twinfan]

[Mark]

in 2004 and 2005 only twinfan. 2003 have grey frames.

[Mark]

Originally posted by JasonBoswell
Originally posted by andyb
You can see here the multiple footrest mounts. This shows its not a 999r frame as they only have two!

To be fair, from your close up piccie I can only see two positions on his frame - the hangers are on the upper setting at the mo.

Still appears dodgy tho...


Me also.

Not convinced all as it seems.

Has anyone asked about the head light unit? Or more pictures?

I would, but i can't read my the replies at work

[andyb]

Originally posted by rockhopper
"Hi there. A quick question about the bike, the 999R doesnt have multiple holes on the bottom footpeg mount like your picture shows. A genuine R frame has just two for homologation purposes. So is the frame 999R or is it from another bike?"

HI, THANKS FOR THE EMAIL, I THINK YOU MAY BE SLIGHTLY WRONG THERE, THE LOGBOOK / FRAME NUMBERS ALL MATCH UP AND IT SAYS 999R, PERHAPS THERE IS MORE THAN ONE STYLE OF FRAME, I DON'T KNOW ? CHEERS

So is he saying it does have the multiple frame mounts? If we say the frame is nor 999r then what exactly is R?

If we say ok it is a 999r frame and logbook, where did ALL the 999 bits come from? There an awful lot of std 999 bike there, sourced from rta damaged stuff? Bought new?? Another source??

[Twinfan]

Why take evrything else off for racing and put them in a different frame? What's wrong with the 999R frame?

Sounds like a re-built write off. Sold all the goodies (Ohlins, carbon, magnesium etc) and put on used standard stuff. May even done it on an exchange basis? My Ohlins for your Showas plus cash etc.

Probably a decent enough 999 if it's been rebuillt correctly, but not what it looks like. What spec 999 motor has it got? Are they sure it's not a 749? What about the ECU, keys etc

[Loz]

So, the frame is grey like a 2003 R, and it appears to have the R's two-setting foot peg setup instead of the standard model's multiple settings, but the swing arm, the Bip rear sub-frame, the Bip seat itself, the fairings, everything else is from a standard 999. The engine and exhaust, all from a standard 999?
At what point do you say, "It's not an "R", it's a standard 999?
I have to ask ... why?

[dickieducati]

so to sum it up;

its a standard 999 and he's selling a 999r number plaque as well. simple. :D

[Mark]

'03 999's have all got the same swing arm, only '04's that changed.


http://www.ducati.com/docs_eng/photogalleries2/999R/images/f04.jpg


http://www.ducati.com/docs_eng/photogalleries2/999/images/f3.jpg

[Mark]

Now check the frames, u will see said bike has an R frame. Point where it meets the rear sub frame the frame is differant to a 999bip or 999S.
http://i1.ebayimg.com/02/i/03/78/f3/cb_3.JPG

helped if i added this! :lol:

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by flanker]

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by flanker]

[rockhopper]

Hmmm, think you might be right there.:(

[Loz]

Flanker's right.

Again though, I ask "why?". :puzzled:

[Twinfan]

Very very strange. It's definitiely an R frame. Must have been a crashed, non-recorded bike. Eveyrthing worth anything has been traded/sold/swapped for standard bip bits. Who knows what the hell the engine is? If it's got the 999R clocks, christ alone knows what the genuine mileage of the motor is?

Why would anyone buy this?????

[Mark]

Because, someone whose never had anything to do with Ducati's might?

Or, this could now be legit? The reason for doing this strange, and maybe TF you are right, been smashed and re built. Frame could have been repaird and re-sprayed to hide the damage. Or he feels he might get more money selling the R frame off than his race bike?? Carbon bodywork is on a racer maybe? or sold elsewhere with the goodies, as mentioned above. The clutch cover is damaged. Is it possible someone has bought an R frame, which has not been recorded as damaged. And parts sourced from elsewhere. Maybe the fairings on the bike are damaged, and repaired? I think the seat unit has damage on it, there seems to be some dark marks on it.

I don't think we'll ever find out what really has happned.

[Walenut]

What do you think he'll get for it £7,500?

[Jools]

I would call a policeman

[TP]

Originally posted by Jools
I would call a policeman

What would you call him?

[stu-st4]

I have asked the seller the question, exactly what engine is in it, where did it come from and who fitted it and is the bike registered to him? that was at about 1pm I have not had a reply. I also note that all the questions being asked are not being made visible to viewers of the auction, this is something the seller chooses to do or not!.:puzzled:

[Mark]

chooses not to.

[Simon Reed]

Right here goes;
it is an auhthentic 999r,with bits removed,as stated by the seller,fact !!
Ducati 999R
Chasis no;ZDMH400AA3B005060
ENGINE NO; ZD999W4-000866
DOFR;12/8/03
LAST KEEPER CHANGE;18/8/04

It was on finance up until 1/2/05

now clear,on hpi !!! so get it bought & stop wining,all ov yer !!!

So all you guys,that are putting the boot in,for the seller,should be careful, what they say,as this looks like a genuine sale,& on the face of it is a cheap bike,and would make an ideal trackbike for someone !!

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by Simon Reed]

[electricsheep]

Originally posted by andyb

If we say ok it is a 999r frame and logbook, where did ALL the 999 bits come from? There an awful lot of std 999 bike there, sourced from rta damaged stuff? Bought new?? Another source??

Also who put it together, was it a ducati trained mechanic. Also I thought that both frame and engine numbers were on the V5.

[Mark]

Originally posted by Simon Reed
Right here goes;
it is an auhthentic 999r,with bits removed,as stated by the seller,fact !!
Ducati 999R
Chasis no;ZDMH400AA3B005060
ENGINE NO; ZD999W4-000866
DOFR;12/8/03
LAST KEEPER CHANGE;18/8/04

It was on finance up until 1/2/05

now clear,on hpi !!! so get it bought & stop wining,all ov yer !!!

So all you guys,that are putting the boot in,for the seller,should be careful, what they say,as this looks like a genuine sale,& on the face of it is a cheap bike,and would make an ideal trackbike for someone !!

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by Simon Reed]

Cannot argue with that, after all was me who realised it was an R frame. So, what has happened to the R parts? Where did the new parts come from? Why go to the expense of getting 999 parts fitted? How did the damage on the clutch casing happen, and is there damage to the rear seat unit? Who re-built it?

I ask this, because Simon you seem to have some answers.:)

[Edited on 22-2-2005 by flanker]

[Twinfan]

Do we know that's the engine that's in it? He said al the R bits had been removed except the frame and clocks, which means the engine has been changed?

[Simon Reed]

Guys,guys @ the end of the day,if ure not buying it,it dosn't matter who built it,or where the bits came from does it,eh ?,i only did what a few of you should have done,in order to authenticate the bike,you do your homework,as i do,before handing over the hard earned,when buying any motor vehicle,most of it's common sense !
if you're not happy with your findings,you don't buy,& walk away,but in this case,the seller has informed us all,of what you're buying,& on the information found,he does appear to be telling the truth !!!
if you're buying it,then visually inspect the frame & chasis no,against the V5(log book) then against the info,i supplied,& thats all you can do,don'think,what if this,what if that,just don't buy it,job done !!

[Twinfan]

We're just curious that's all...

[Simon Reed]

bump.

[Iconic944ss]

Personally if the donor parts came from a suspect source I'd be very worried - I hope the seller turns out to be genuine and can afford to give away what appears to be a few thousand pounds worth of profit.

Regards - Frank

[misterpink]

i think it is reassuring that people on this site bring these things into the open for various reasons - we all get blinded sometimes when buying our dream bike (only once though!) but maybe if the dodgy people who are traders/sellers/parts people think it is going to be a bit harder to get away with it they will move away from Ducati's - as a victim of crime i would support any "sensible" method on making sure that our hard-earned treasures are kept safe - if you are genuine then no worries eh?

[The Big Red One]

Does it mean that someones standard 999 has gone missing at some point to get all them parts.

[Rally]

Quite

[stu-st4]

Well said MisterPink, I thinks it's excellent that a bunch of well meaning guy's & girls who are passionate about motorcycles are willing to take the time to look into things that don't look quite right. As you say if it's genuine you got nothing to worry about, so well said again.