******** Clutch
 

Decided to try to bleed the sodding clutch, air got into the system, and I cant bloody get it out :mad:
Been standing around like a lemon pumping the lever etc and I'm getting nowhere fast :mad: After an hour theres still no resistance at the lever :(

Anyone got any suggestions? Been thinking of defecting and getting a zx10 recently, this is pushing me one step closer :mad:

I need some help before I really lose it :lol:

I prefer to do it off the bike and put a G-clamp across the slave cylinder to give you something solid to pump against, just like you have if your doing the brakes.Also you can mount the Slave higher so the air will rise to the bleed nipple.

Do a search on here DJ, I'm sure this was mentioned very recently......something about slackening off a banjo or bleed nipple????? to actually let the air out

same happened to me it's a swine.
set up to bleed as normal
pump clutch a few times then hold in leaver.loosen bleed niple and then tighten with lever still in.repeat as needed( a lot )

been doin that mate, even tried undoing the nut at the cylinder.

Been doin this for an hour!

Go to a chemist and get a small syringe(no needle) you can draw the fluid through your normal tube connected to the bleed nipple on the slave then rather than try to pump it, works for me!

clutch
 

Dj take the cylinder off ! remove and clean up the piston then put some grease (smidgen) around the seal ! Then push the piston all the way in to the cylinder ! RE-fit the cylinder then top up the resovoir with clean fluid and bleed as normal !!! THIS WILL DO THE TRICK !!!!! regards mav :cool:

Right, I took the slave cylinder off, unfortunately couldn't remove the piston from the motor (I assume thats the piston mav?)

Went down to the "late night" pharmacy at 6.45 - shut :mad:

Gonna try again tomorrow....
Wheres the cheapest place to buy a ZX10R?? :alien:

Dj get a lenght of pipe that will fit real tight on the bleed nipple !you will need the pipe at least 2 ft long then open nipple and hold pipe up above the height of the master cylinder !
then fill the pipe 3/4 full of brake fluid and then gently blow the fluid through the pipe ( empty master cylinder first) make sure as you blow fluid up through the system (A) the pipe does not run out of fluid ! if it looks like its gonna ,hold thumb over end of pipe and tighten bleed nipple up !!
basically you are back feeding the system in reverse and pussing the air up to the master cylinder !! its hard to explain how to do it !!!! but it will work ... mav:cool:

How am i gonna get brake fluid to go in the pipe/tube though? It'll just spill every where surely?

you know my syringe method makes sense.... look for an old thread with old yella, itll work.
Dont pss about taking anything off the bike, its only air!!!

Andy your way seems the easiest, have to wait til the chemist opens, or I could just go to the local council estate...

Oh, you said NO needle :lol:

2 of the bolts holding the slave cylinder on have gone walkies too, bloody vibey twins!

dj just trying to help ! its easier to do than explain ! sorry if it looked confusing! regards mav

bleed nipples


these may be of help !!! they do next day postage as well

mav wasn't having a dig mate, was just wondering how to get the fluid out of the bottle and in to a tube or pipe!

no probs dj ! u are a bit to far 4 me to cum sort it 4 ya! so hope all goes well 4 ya 2 moz! ;)mav

what a little confusing you have said you have left the piston behind and you will need it in place or it will just run out and get air in.

DJ,
I had EXACTLY the same problem last year..tried the syringe, took the slave apart, clamped the piston...all to no avail...
What finally worked was: undo the handlebar clamp, tilt the lever/master cylinder assembly upwards so that air can rise from the banjo bolt (at handlebar end) and into the master cylinder. Hey presto..little bubbles of air come skipping merrily into the master cylinder and the lever pressure miraculously returns!
Give it a whirl..it takes about 5 mins.
Good luck.

The easiest way is to install a bleeder fitting up at the clutch master cylinder since any air bubbles in the system will rise to the highest point. Why Ducati put the bleed valve at the system low point I’ll never understand.



If you can't find one, you can try just loosening the bolt slightly and bleed air from the banjo bolt as if it were a bleeder fitting.

Be careful to avoid spraying the hydraulic fluid. Keep plenty of rags handy to clean up any spills and cover everything. The fluid is corrosive and will damage painted surfaces and certain plastics.

I cant believe that photo - clear fluid - mine only stays like that for about a week and that with a new slave piston, Goodrich hose and DoT 5 fluid!

It’s the brake fluid. The above picture shows fluid that’s been in there since August 2001 when I changed to an Evoluzione Cyclesports slave cylinder. I used Valvoline SynPower Dot 3/4 fluid - Part No. 057 (boiling points: dry 513ºF, wet 333ºF.) Everything else is stock.

See ...
http://ducatisportingclub.com/contro...d.php?tid=7924

Mav I tried your idea and a rubber boot thing popped out of the reservoir :o

Have I ****ed the master cylinder?

Have you been trying to bleed it with that rubber thing in the reservoir? That could be your problem!!

Dunno mate, emptied the master cylinder. started pumping brake fluid thru the slave cylinder, next thing i know this rubber thing pops out! :o
There's no air in the system, I've put fresh fluid in and bled til no more air, but still no bloody pressure :( :(


Deffo tempted by that ZX-10R now

Assuming its bled correctly then perhaps its something like a proken push rod thats causing the lack of pressure.

When you pull the lever can you hear anything happening down by the slave cylinder? On my bike i can hear the piston move if it quiet.

Take out the three bolts holding the slave cylinder to the engine, get the rubber dust seal out of the way and then gently pull the lever and you should be able to see the piston moving. Dont pull to hard or too far or the piston will pop out and you'll have to start all over again!!

Re the rubber thing, when you take the cap off you should see this soft circular rubber thing in there. Take that out before you try any bleeding.

Can't hear anything, there is no lever pressure whatsoever! I can hear a swishing sound from near the lever when I pull it

Could be that there's air trapped in the feed pipe from the reservoir to the master cylinder.
As the bore of this pipe is quite small and there is no pressure in it, it can be difficult to bleed the air from it.
The quick answer to the problem is the " Easibleed " or similar where you are pushing the fluid through from the reservoir using air pressure.
If you don't have one of those, try this.......
The technique I use to get rid of it is to half fill the reservoir, then every 5 seconds or so, move the lever a tiny amount, perhaps only 10mm of movement at the tip.
As you do this, look into the reservoir & you should see a small bubble of air appear from the hole at the bottom of the reservoir.
Slowly but surely, you willl bleed out any air in the feed pipe until you have only brakefluid in the tube to the master cylinder at which point you will notice a slight change in feel to the lever.
From then on, bleed the clutch circuit as normal.
This is a really frustrating technique but after 5 minutes or so you should be well on the way.
Don't be tempted to use bigger movements as all you will do is force the air back down towards the master cylinder putting you back to square 1.
Enjoy!
Andy

Basically what I did was use a syringe to push fluid thru the slave and into the master - the master is now full (but I dunno what to do with this rubber boot thing) and still no pressure!

The slave cylinder looked REALLY manky when I took it off to inspect it - but it was working before i tried to bleed the clutch, so I'm at a loss now :(

Heres a pic of the rubber thing

dj just explain to us how you are bleeding the clutch? are you pumping the lever and then undoing the bleed nipple and nipping it back up before letting go of the lever?

That rubber thingy is a folded rubber diaphragm that allows the level of the fluid in the reservoir to change without creating a change in reservoir pressure that would prevent proper master cylinder function. It’s main function is to prevent the hydraulic fluid from absorbing moisture from the air.

It’s supposed to be installed with the rubber part folded up into the cap and the reservoir filled.

Each time you pull the clutch or brake lever, you pump some fluid out of the reservoir, each time you release the lever, the fluid flows back into the reservoir. A little hole in the reservoir cap lets air in and out to equalize the pressure in the reservoir, but without the diaphragm the fluid will absorb moisture from humid air. As the fluid absorbs moisture, it’s boiling point drops and vapor bubbles develop that cause brake fade. Obviously fade isn’t an issue with clutches but the moisture in the fluid will still corrode metal parts that come in contact with it.

So like any diaphragm, you don’t really need to put it in, but there may come a point when you wish you did.:lol:

No, I gave up on that cos it wasnt doing ****, so i used a syringe to force all the fluid out and start again by pushing it through the slave cylinder until it goes up into the reservoir

Mate. Use the syringe to pull not push!!

Fill the master cylinder with fluid. Attatch a bleed pipe to the slave bleed nipple, and push the syringe into the other end of the pipe. Now open the nipple and draw the syringe back. This will pull fluid and the bubbles, ie anything that is in the system through the nipple. As you get to the end of the stroke of the syringe, close the nipple off.
Take off the syringe and empty it, reconnect and repeat until you get clear fluid through, not forgettting to top up the master cylinder.

If it helps, use a cable tie to hold the clutch lever back during the operation.

Calling Nelly, help needed
 

DJ, give nelly a call
it'll work, promise
get it sorted very soon, riding weather this weekend methinks
rgds
mort:roll:

Morty, its the least of my worries - forks need to go to K-Tech for a service/overhaul as does the shock,then the bike needs to get checked for frame alignment, as well as the yokes and wheel spindle :(

Will be a while before it's back on the road again :(




Must...... resist.......

dj you got it sorted yet? mav:cool:

No mate :( managed to get fluid all the way from cylinder to slave, but still no pressure!

Thing is , if it aint broke dont fix it!
If you bugger about with your new zx10 thingy, if u go for it, thatll probably break n all!!

dj i wish you would fone me ! i could explain it better over the phone ! as i takes me forever to type with 1 finger!!!!!!!!:cool: mav 07971 673899 (orange):)

Problem is it WAS broke, been getting totally inconsistent lever pressure lately, sometimes the clutch wouldnt disengage enough to let me hold 1st at the lights, other times it wouldnt engage properly resulting in slip - the bloody biting point would change whenever it felt like it!!!

Mav I'll give ya a call in a minute mate, thanks! :D

[Edited on 20-4-2004 by DJ Tera]