Front brakes seized.....
 

I know there is a lot of intrest in this subject and the on going saga that Twinfan is experiencing, so I thought i'd post this in the hope that shared knowledge will help others.

Out on the bike on sunday, (20/03/05) beautiful day, (for once) intending to open her up, get the blood flowing... Doing about 44mph, when the bike started to feel strange, couldn't seem to accelerate. Thought maybe there was a problem with the engine as i've recently had to have the ECU replaced. So I rolled of the throttle and pulled in the clutch with the intention of changing up into 3rd, and the bike just stopped all by itself. It stopped in an incredible short distance, quicker than if i'd been attempting an emergency stop. Turns out the front brakes had seized/locked up. Luckily I didn't pitch over the handle bars or lose control. Even more lucky that I didn't get on the brakes in a panic, or I would have been off - no question.

Bike is now back at the dealers - Ducati have requested a safety report with pictures, seem to be treating it as serious, which of course it is!

I have to say a that the dealers have been first rate so far, and have lend me a courtesy bike without hesitation - so i'll keep you posted.

For the record it's 04' 749 Dark.

Interesting....

So that's possibly 3 so far, main thing is you're OK

Which dealer did you take it to, and purchase your bike from?

Charles Hurst in Belfast.
Initially the guy was very sceptical, saying that he'd never heard of such a thing happening before. I told him about what happened to Twinfan, and the DSC notice board, but he kinda poo-pooed the idea as Ducati hadn't mentioned any problems. However after he had an opportunity to see the bike and the colour of the disc's, he seemed to change his mind. Apparently there're going to replace the disc's, calipers and pads - but at the minute, the thoughts of getting back on the bike don't fill me with enthusiasm - despite the fact i'm riding the R6 courtesy bike.

well done for keeping it upright!!

Will be watching this very carefully...

Let us know what happens!

Whoa!!! Another one!!! And a 749 again too!

When was the bike registered in '04? Was it around May time by any chance???????

Glad you're OK by the way - could've been very nasty! That's exactly what happened on my bike too, only I couldn't stay on :(

Surely Ducati need to get this sorted very quickly, dread to think what might happen if the brakes seize on a rider leading a bunch of mates on a group ride.

Come on Ducati, this need sorting - NOW.

Glad your ok.

My 04 749S goes in for its first service on the 1st April, I will be asking for a full examination of the braking system.

Thats three cases at least now we have heard of, how many don't we know about?:puzzled:

Exactly!

How many other 749's are out there and the riders are blissfully unawares of potential issues, I say potential as nothing has been proved yet. I think the DSC has quite a large audience and I'd imagine goes someway to getting stuff like this out to a wider group of people.

But this could clearly be a serious risk to the owner/rider which worst case could result in a fatality

Yep, three we know of. If necroscope's bike is from May 2004, then that sounds like a possible faulty batch of callipers from Brembo. Interesting that they were building 749s at the time and no 999s. I wonder how many bikes are time bombs waiting to go off?

This could be quite a large problem, depending on the size of the batch numbers of Brembo callipers...

You would hope, soon a safety re-call will be called, if all the problems are related, and from the same build time. I wonder how many machines are required with a problem before a re-call is made.

I remember discusing with someone somtime ago about how they determine if they (generic motor company not ducati) need to recall.

It was something along the lines of cost benefit for the company. They balance up the cost of the recall against the cost of being sued for accidents or even fatalities relating to it.

Don't know how true that was, but pretty scary when you think about it. It wasn't the fact that someone could die, more how much it would cost them if they did!

Registered late April 04'.
Seems unlikely that Ducati would admit to such a fundamental problem with their 'prestige' 749/999 range. But then, like this website proves, word of mouth can be very powerful!

Cheers nero - the build date ties in with other cases. More than likely a faulty batch of one of the braking components discs/pads/callipers is to blame.

I'm still waiting for Ducati to get back to me and let me know how they're going to resolve my problem of:

£5500 of bike damage (possible write off territory)
A list of required parts as long as your arm
Time delay in getting all those parts (assuming my bike would be fixed)
A written-off Arai
Damaged gloves and jacket
Scars on my right forearm
Two weeks of severe bruising to my right arm and right leg

Could this be a master cyl issue, not bleeding back. Had you had a recent service?

The cost/life/legal action you refer to I believe was the Ford motor company in america with respect to the fuel tanks exploding in rear end collisions.
Executive decision was that cost of recall to refit with sub $100 part would cost more than the probable number of compensation claims arising from the accident.
Needless to say they were "outed" in court and justice administered.
There is currently more class actions taking place with same company re: Victor Crown police vehicles and allegedly exploding collisions. (search Guardian webite for full scripts)

The cost for substantiation of a UK bypass is- if bypass saves one life then the budget is £4M. Any more and it is unlikely to receive planning permission. Kind of like a points system.

Mine can't be the master cylinder as only one disc has turned blue. Spartacus had the same problem as myself/necroscope and they replaced the discs/pads/callipers but not the master cylinder (as it sounds lilke they're going to do with necroscope).

V2_Pete had a master cylinder fault so his case is different.

This sounds like exactly the sort of issue that the DSC management should be discussing directly with Ducati UK. If the lives of our members are at risk there can be no more urgent issue. It's a disgrace that DUK haven't sorted this out already and warned other 749 owners of the possible implications.

I would imagine Ducati UK watch this board and several others everyday, and maybe someone somewhere there right now is reading this thread and the alarm bells are ringing...

Another one!!!
I have just phoned Ducati Manchester regarding the Judder i experienced at the weekend and waiting for the workshop managher to call me back. I'll let you know what he has to say...

Cheers Stuart - let us know.

Ducati UK do read this board, so they will know what the feeling of the Ducati community is.

When is the line crossed for life threatening/niggles.

Brakes seizing in anyones books has to be life threatening.
Misfires - ala JPM et al. Life threatening if your turning onto a main road into a flow of traffic (believe me.... you clutch it, gas it hard and hope for the best)
[rant] ANY vehicle which has faults should be rectified/recalled forthwith by manufacturer - fit for purpose etcetera.

Considering that Ducati, imho, are considered to be the upper end of the quality bike market then I am becoming more dissapointed in their end product. Until a couple of weeks ago I thought it was probably just me being critical of what is an otherwise excellent bike.
When it's on form then I don't think that any other bike comes near giving the same grin factor and feeling of self satisfaction.
But now..? I now have to wait 2 weeks for bike to go in for the potential lfe threatening misfire to be resolved. Dare I ride it in the meantime? Like fook I will. I've still gotta get it to the garage and I ain't lookin forward to that.
Everyone's got their own opinion and the majority probably got excellent machines with maximum grin and no problems.
But for an £11K+ motor? C'mon.

Unless DUK magically pull a rabbit out the hat and restore my faith then I shan't be revisiting the fold after this bike.


btw, if DUK are reading this, WAKE UP TO THE PROBLEMS!!!!
[/rant]

I'm off to the Nuburgring this weekend with one of MCN's road testers. I'll run this by him & see if MCN want to take up the story/ investigation.

Well said Alan.

Ducati should note that people like Alan have been Ducati fans for a long time, having owned many of their machines, and would like for this to continue. These people deserve better treament.

Is anyone from DUK looking in? any chance of a response?

This is true of many I am guessing, myself personally am on my third Ducati on the trot, had a few issues with my 996 which were sorted under warranty, my 998 never ever missed a beat, and the 999 well I'm already having my doubts to the point where I am pretty close to shopping it in for a ZX10R if things don't improve.

The 749/999 hasn't exactly set the world on fire in terms of sales, but that isn't surprising considering what they had achieved in the 916 et al. But they made the rod for their own back there really I guess.

So trying to sell the new bike it must be seen as a major leap forward not only in performance/handling but more so for joe public reliability, which it seems to be lacking for some at least

I won't be buying a 749 then!:o

I wouldn't be writing Ducati (or 749/999s) off on the strength of these problems just yet. They're waiting on Brembo to finish their analysis of my brakes, and may well have others to look at too. They'll then need to decide how best to deal with it.

The level of customer care that I receive will be the deciding factor (for me at least) in whether I stay in the Ducati fold or defect ASAP.

Comthing to consider :

http://www.vosa.gov.uk/vosa/motteste...andrecalls.htm

Yes I am a long time fan of Ducati, and yes I have owned a couple.

But I don't think it matters whether you've owned one or one hundred.

Put yourself in my shoes for a second, although not on a bike.
[soapbox]
You buy yourself the new model lexus / honda / bmw / vauxhall / ford / peugot / daewoo / hyundai / etcetera
(Delete as necessary)
It's one of the top models, no extras, no embellishments, bog standard.
Within it's first year you climb in and start it up.
You get half a mile down the road and at a tee junction you join the main carriageway...****, firing only on two cylinders, popping and farting. The engines still going but only just and with half power you try desperately for added boost just to avoid an accident with cars rapidly approaching from behind.
What do you do?!? Car fires back up and you carry on your journey.
Next available opportunity you take it to the dealer who apologises profusely, gives you a courtesy car and doesn't expect the car back till it's sorted good and proper.


Now tell me why that should be any different to the way you're treated by Ducati.

:mad:
[/soapbox]

You should get exactly that kind of treatment from Ducati.

Yourself, me any many others tend to be very loyal to Ducati, this loyalty can be built up over many years, but lost overnight.

I think this problem lies with the dealer though in the first instance, not Ducati UK.

There are several delears which constantly get praise on here, and several that don't fair too well.

And as people have pointed out customer service is key here. Look at the whole paddock stand saga I had with D/Mcr it was going on for months, and in the end I dropped Ducati UK an email and within a few weeks it was resolved, if it was that easy and quick to resolve why could D/Mcr do it and let the issue drag on for several months.

[Edited on 23-3-2005 by JPM]

Just back from the dealer who informed me that the photo's requested by Ducati have been sent. They now have to wait for a reply, apparently the fix/replacements is dependant on what Ducati says as to whether it all gets done under warranty or not. Or the fault is with the bike...

Will wait to pass judgment on that one, as part of me feels like a good old anglo saxon rant on the subject of Ducati having to decide whether the parts are replaceable under warranty or it might have been something i've done. Like most, if not all Ducati owners, I treat my bike like it's my most treasured possession, and would take exception to anyone suggesting that the front brakes seizing was down to me!

Have to wait and see.

So Alan has your bike been back to the dealer until it was fixed? and if not surely he is at fault for not fixing it as its only a mechanical piece of equipment at the end of the day.

If one dealer can't sort it then perhaps like JPM you need to try someone else:o

Think you're right there John, but if Ducati UK have taken it upon themselves to "allow" these dealers to have the franchise, then surely the buck stops there. For any problem to have escalated to the point of sending e-mail to DUK without satisfactory dealer resolution then surely warnign bells should have been sounding in their offices a long time ago. One only has to look at some of the threads in this forum.
WRT the problem being with the dealer, how serious a problem does it have to be before the manufacturers UK HQ gets involved?

each time it went in it was head scratching and "well, it's alright now when we start it":mad:
Some people don't have sufficient resources to be able to take time out get the bike to "other" dealers. no disrespect to anyone on board.


[Edited on 23-3-2005 by guest1]

[Edited on 23-3-2005 by guest1]

This is exactly the situation I'm in, only due to the subsequent accident damage to my bike no-one wants to pay up. Someone somewhere is liable - be it the dealer, Ducati UK, Ducati Sp or Brembo - but no-one wants to pay out until liability is sorted :mad:

Not the way to treat customers of a prestige marque who have spent £10,000+ on your motorcycle in my opinion.

[Edited on 23-3-2005 by Twinfan]

Ditto

After what you've been through I would have thought that the least, and I mean the very least you're owed is an abject apology and some form of compensation. Not waiting around without a bike, for someone to decide you fate when you could have lost your life. My biggest fear when I bought the 749, was to have a 3yr debt and no bike to ride due to me making a stupid mistake, at least I have the courtesy bike which sweetens the pill somewhat.

I'm trying to be fair as I had to start an insurance claim and my insurers held things up for 3 weeks. They completed what they needed to do 2 weeks ago, so I'm now starting to lose my patience somewhat.

I'll be calling the dealer tomorrow afternoon for an update, where I'm expecting an answer.

As this is a serious safety issue please consider informing VOSA the goverment agency responsible.

From their website..

VOSA conduct Roadworthiness inspections on vehicles involved in accidents where it is suspected that there may have been a contributory mechanical defect. This enables us to further investigate reports of alleged safety defects in vehicles and components. In the case of serious recurring safety faults, manufacturers conduct a recall under the code of practice for vehicle safety defects that is administered and supervised by VOSA.

Owing to other courtesy bikes being dropped, D/Mcr no longer run courtesy bikes.
GREAT!:mad:
Utter friggin ****ing ****ing **** farcical

[Edited on 23-3-2005 by guest1]