Porsche tried to replace the 911 with the 4 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars. They were crap and nobody bought them. So they persevered with the 911 and today it is better than ever.

Ducati tried to replace the 916/748 with the 999/749 but they were crap and nobody bought them. Wouldn't it be great if they brought the 916/748 back ?

Steve, I bet you knew what you were going to get before you started this thread, go on admit it, go on, go on. The majority of people buy a bike because of its looks, secondly how it rides. I have a 996R, I absolutly love it, wouldnt change for anything.The 999 to me is a no go, straight away the looks killed it for me, others saw it and thought wow i want one of those. No amount of pursuasion (sp?) would change your mind. Get this one because of this, get that one because of that, just get the one YOU want. Now then, I think you should have the 998R, but who am I to sway you one way or other. as I have said your mind is already made up. Happy riding........on that 998R:lol::lol:

I guess its a bit different as you are looking at more comparable prices (or maybe even 998 being more money) and higher spec.

I have debated both (749r and 998s for me though) and although I love the old shape and really haven't come to terms with the new shape yet (its growing very slowly) I think that the new bike is obviously going to have some benefits such as still in warranty, newer technology etc.

Although the final decision for me has been price if it were down to a straight decision I think I may have gone for the 749r.

But.... having said that... in your case there would be no doubt! The 998r is iconic, stunning, best performance and has soul. The 999s is a great bike I am sure but it just doesn't compare if you want to have something you truly feel passionate about!!

The 916/996/998 are Iconic shapes, Show me another bike that takes up a residence in the Guggenheim. I love the cutting edge modern lines of the 999/749's these did have a hard act to follow. At the end of the day its a Ducati which is what matters.

Well said Freak.....come on you lot...get with it its 2005 not 1985 :lol::lol:

Not saying the old one was a bad bike...But sometimes you just need to move on and have a change.

:cool:

999s without doubt the best bike iv'e owned.

The 999 is not that bad, it’s just new and it’s got a lot to bet. I think it is like the new BMW’s, at the start most people tort what the f*+k, but now the look is growing on people.
The same with the 999 it hard to bet something so good and sexy, but it is a better bike. Ducati made bike for so long, there must be a reason for the change, just trust Mr ducati he did make the old shape and he’s bikes are the best.
Im sticking with my 748 for now. I call it taking my time to save up for the new one.

Why you should buy the 998r

1/ because when you open your garage your bike will not have to grow on you or anyone else

2/ because it was missing off the Ducati stand this year and so were most of the punters

3/ because the japs are coming this year and Franky coming with them.
(He’s an old git who didn’t win but he still cries when he duz)

4/ because it’s the work of a design genius employed by the Ducati factory
(You can see his latest work at MV)
5/ because every sports bike on the market has become a poor imitation of the original 916 design

6/ because Ducati may have to kick-start sales high’s of the nineties with changes of design to create a bike that evokes the shear joy of opening the garage door and seeing your one.

7/ because you don’t have to change with the times, you can ride the times that you liked

8/ because if you need more riding equipment than the 998r you need a sponsor


:cool::cool:

:eureka::D thats good. Real good . I love it ok ok you got a good point. :bouncy::bouncy::bouncy:

You mean like a fungus?

Sorry its taken so long to reply to ducsoon? Query about the 999 having no advantages.
Annette absolutely loves riding the 999 but I dont think she would swap her 996sps for it. It took most of last summer for me to feel comfortable on the bike,it may be in my head but the front end felt remote and I coudnt commit as hard going into corners. The 999 is definately easier to ride on the road and may lap at the same pace as the 998 with less rider effort but if you cant trust the front end you end up going slower than you could. 180 miles on the 998 results in slight stiffeness in my kneck and knees both due to old injuries, the 999 is literally a pain in the butt after about 40 mph (and i have adequate personal padding).
The 999 has a multitude of advantages for ducati as a manufacturer, it was designed to be assembled from sub assemblies and the elecrical system is cheaper to manufacture and install. When ridden It is less prone to wheelie under power and the rear doesnt lift as much on hard braking but this may be due to the fact the factory set them up very flat with a low rear ride height.
personally I prefer the iconic shape of the 998 but that has nothing to do with my preferences, the 998 is in my opinion a safer road bike (mirrors!! on the 999) and for me a better track bike.

Its horses for courses, the only way to find what fits you personally is to badger a dealer into test rides on a 998 and a 999


dave spreading confusion with every phrase!!

loads of people complain about ducati's being a pain in the arse but i've never found this, and to be fair if you're riding for 180 miles with your arse in one position you're not riding a ducati where it is best: either in the twisties or on track.

Thanks for your views on this.
It seems to me that the 999 is more stable, or at least has a more stable front end. Perhaps that why the front end felt remote to you.
I have to admite i've never even rode a Duc, but a friend of mine recently sold his 996 SPS and got a 04 R1 and he complained he didn't felt the front end.
Tell me, in terms of flickability do you notice any difference between the 998 and the 999???

You're right i'l have to try both before i decide.

Dude, it sounds like you need to get out on both and see how you get on. Bearing in mind that both of your choices have extremely adjustable suspension so if it's not quite to your taste then you can get the suspension setup just for you. I would recommend doing this regardless of your choice, it just gives you so much more confidence.

For example, I have a W reg 996 and after a little while of riding it I just couldn't get on with the front end. It felt remote and like it was pushing. This was due to bad suspension setup and the front tyre scalloping (which was again down to the suspension setup). I took the bike to HM Racing in Kent on the recommendation from a few others here on the board and they found that the rear shock was leaking and not providing enough rebound damping so they rebuilt it, they replaced the rear spring because it was too hard (it's a bip) and adjusted the front suspension.

I was at a point where I was really not very happy with the handling of the bike and starting to think about getting something else but now it feels awesome. Goes where I want it to go, great front end feedback and turns nicely.

Now I just need to have the same done to my 'wee' monster! It handles like a small boat!

Its gotta be the 998R - or even better the 996R!!!

Ducati have attempted to go to mass market appeal with the 999 and have by any reasoned, independant view, missed!

The 999 is built at a cheaper budget, using less parts than the 998 type and has been built to appease a fickle market place that is driven by a perceived need to want ride the latest and greatest technology every year.

Ducati had to evolve, economics and market pressures determined that - but if you want the latest and greatest superbike, you go look at the Japanese offerings (yep - I've done that).

But if you want emotion, soul and a reluctant envy from every other motorbike rider, get the archetypal 916.

The 996R is the best of this breed, but settle if you must for the 998R.

Tim:ninja:

Actually , the first year of 999 production outsold the last year of 998 production :sing:

It just seems like the new shape bikes arn't selling as well because of how many 916 shape bikes there are due to 10 years of production :cool:

I personally like both shapes about the same , but my 749R is technically years ahead of my old 748R and much higher spec , which would you have ?

Tim

You must be the 996R's biggest fan.

Mr. Egg,

There will always be some demand for the highest spec models produced by Ducati, latterly the SPS and now R bikes.

However the 'cooking' 999s and 749s have been a huge sales disappointment for Ducati (as Rattler states) - I don't think anyone disputes this ?

I am, I was drooling over yours only yesterday!!! Handbuilt engines, world championship winning, rarer than a Desmo Due tyre decision!!;) - fabulous. Wanna sell it?

Yours just needs a good clean!! Oh yeh, and some forks!!!;)

Tim:ninja:

I am with Tim and love the 996r, truly the dream ducati as far as I am concerned.

The figures for sales for the last year of 998 production and first year of 999 production were quoted by Ducati themselves in MCN and they were very happy with the 999 outselling it's predecessor.

I think the main reason for falling sales is the Japanese competition is getting much better , older blades and GSXR / ZXR 750's were similar performance to a 916 / 96 / 98 at a cheaper price , todays R1 / GSXR1000 / ZX10R are way ahead on power compared to a 999 and still a lot cheaper.

WSB is also no longer a big seller for bikes , as much as I thought (and still do) that Foggy is a complete pratt his success sold an awful lot of Ducatis , I think Rossi's popularity and TV coverage of MotoGP is doing for Honda and Yamaha now what WSB did for Ducati 10 years ago.


.......now , if we could just get Vale to ride a Desmosedici , then watch 'em fly out of the showrooms :sing:

Were you up at Nellys yesterday? What were you upto?

It does need a clean but no point in doing that before Neil puts his oily fingerprints all over it, it'll get minted up on its return.

Shock and forks are away at KAIS at the moment, roll on full service, fresh suspension and better weather.

Sorry, no i don't want to sell it BUT if you fancy a SPS............................................... .................................................. ..........................................

Anyone see Shallow Hal t'other night?:frog:

How much for the SPS?

:lol::lol::lol: very true.

£7995.

In fact the man in the next office wants it for a bit more with the helibars fitted but he can't flog his R1.

Bike sales should pick up in the spring so it will go in the next few months. Did your 996R go to Adam, reading between the lines in a few postings or am i barking (mad) up the wrong tree?

to answer the point on a steering differences on the 999 it feels lighter and more flickable on the road but becomes heavy when turning hard at speed on the track, whereas the 998 although apearing to take more effort at road speeds the steering is consistant at higher speeds and faster/harder inputs. I discussed this when the 999 came out with jamie wilkins(journalist) and Paul young and they felt the apparent lower effort was due to the bars being higher and slightly wider allowing greater leverage whilst in a normal riding position. the 998 steers perfectly well if you countersteer correctly with the correct body position, the 999 handlebar position and width allows adequate levaerage even with poor body position and therefore lower leverage that a road riding position requires.
For a faster turn in on iether bike fit metzer racetech? the replacement for rennesports I fitted a set (190/120) to the 999 and the rear tyre has and extremely high profile, so much so that I had to space my hugger and it felt almost twitchy untill I wound up the steering damper a bit.

dave

She did go to Adam and I'm regretting it!!!

Great info again. Thanks :)
Have you ever fitted a 180 rear tyre on any of them?
I think it must be great for the track, especially if it's a twisty track.

A 180 rear is a must really - unless you're running a 6ich rim.

Tim

Tim you are probably feeling like I did when i sold her to you. I couldnt beleive it when you said it was for sale. couldnt wait to have her back. Here to stay. :bouncy:

My understanding is the 999 has a 6 inch rim and has to have the 190, all the other bikes run a 180 rear. As Tim says the 180 on the 916/996/998 rears is a must unless it has a 6 inch rim.

dave

neither bike turns like a modern japanese in line 4 but most people adapt quite quickly

[Edited on 9-2-2005 by DAVE HARRIS]

i think the 999 has a 5.5 inch rear too.

well mine has anyway.

[Edited on 9-2-2005 by dickieducati]

This from Ducati.com for a 999R ..

Rear wheel - Y-shaped 5-spoke light alloy forged 5.50 x 17

Good job as I have a raft of 180 profile 208GP's ready for the R

I didn't expect all these replys. cant get a test on the 999s at the moment because i want a 05 bike. my old 998s is up for sale at JHP if anybodys interested, Its in mint condition, its also on the sticky rubber web site if you want to take a look

It would seem that I am a bit late in joining in on this topic but......
Just take a look at Porsche!
They had decided to scrap the 911 shape and go with the newer 928 format - hmmmmm!
The rest as the say is history.
928 no longer with us - 911 is!!
I now have a very nice 996 Red Bull Replica and have looked at the 999's - no thank you - well not yet anyway.
Lets face it they are all the envy of the motorcycle world.
What ever you ride - stay safe.
Cheers
SPS

What's in a name?

Is the 911 today, the same 911 as it was?
I don't think so - the only thing the current (997 type) 911 shares with the 911 (964 type?) that survived the 928 is the rear engine configuration.

You can't say that it's still the same car, for whatever reasons the 911 has had to evolve into what it is today.

Ducati has allowed the 916/996/998 series to evolve too, and there is no denying there desirability even to this day.

But regardless of how desirable it is, when evolution (and production) stops, you just find yourself riding an old bike.

Or you can take the opportunity to move with the times.

Cheers!

Scott

But with a current 911 you can see where it is coming from even if it shares nothing with its predecessors. Ducati had a huge style change between the 851/888 and the 916 series, which worked, and another change between the 916 and the 999, which in my opinion did'nt, maybe it would have been better to morph from 998 to a 999 over a couple of years. Went on a 6 month waiting list for my first 916, withdrew my deposit as soon as I saw a 999. Maybe 2007 will be better

Check around the dealers you might get a new '04 999R for not that much more than an '05 999S