I should also point out that push email with windows can be secure as well using certificate based SSL encryption ... hell if you were really keen you could also have your corporate mobile devices using SSL encryption through an IPSec tunnel ...

That's just more infrastructure though = more expense and ultimately more data = more cost/higher tariff as it's not "true" push it still poles which eats into your data :D

More infrastructure for what? The SSL/IPSec tunnel? Not really, corporates that want secure mail delivered to mobile devices already have a PKI infrastructure (for free anyway if they use CLM) and you can get Exchange mail to mobile devices native to Exchange, without the need to buy RIM's software ... which is more expense etc ;)

As for mobile data plan usage, the extra data used is minimal. The mobile device keeps a tcpip session open with Exchange through keepalive pings using tiny packets of data. Harldy a killer feature when you consider the office integration that you can get with Windows mobile devices.

In the medium to enterprise market the business is highly likely to have an Enterprise licensing agreement with MS that means that deploying this is no additional cost. Both methods of obtaining mobile push mail have their advantages and disadvantages but it's these EA's and integration that have seen corporates moving away from Blackberry - certainly that's what we've seen as we are getting more and more business in this space.

Well not from BB's perspective 66% growth over last year 21 million current live connections, and still the ONLY secure messaging/app platform certainly helps with most companies, you still need lots to deploy from a WM perspective compared to BB, crikey the softwares even free and runs on the same box as your messaging server!

The big thing is data tariff's and battery life for the end user, I've been to so many corporates who all complain about this, they even have a WM device and a normal phone from work as the battery can't hack the day because of the poling back and to to the messaging server, and complaints of tarriff as it sync the entire mailbox, I'm sure this is configurable but can you imagine sync'ing a couple of gigs worth of data OTA? So that's 2 connections per user 2 tariff's just to mobilise 1 user.

Putting it another way BB don't even see WM as a threat, the ONLY competitor in this space are Apple and that's a consumer device anyways, the BB brand gets bigger and bigger something that no-one else has currently.

And BB don't make games consoles :frog:

I think I've already proven that BB is NOT the only secure messaging/app platform. Which bit about SSL encryption did you miss? Or using IPSec tunnels?

You can configure how WM syncs with the mailbox but only deltas are sent OTA. Same with attachment handling, you get a header and can choose to download the whole attachment if you want to. So if anyone is syncing gigs of data OTA then it's down to ignorance and poor config - certainly not an advantage of BB over WM.

Two tariff's?! I think that's a bit of BB marketing hype. I grant you battery life isn't as good as BB devices but necesitating an extra phone?! Ppfffttt!

I was just involved in the infra design for a large corporate moving from BB to WM and we are seeing more and more of it. The same in the US. And they don't use two tariffs.

I think you've got some old marketing data there big guy :p

That is it. I will just get an iPhone :lol:

:p :lol: :D

Until WM gets any kind of government approval it's deemed insecure no government agency will touch it, I've been heavily involved in a government procurement exercise and deployment recently and they won't even install the latest software or firmware as they are going through approval as we speak but that's in excess of a 1000 connections, WM didn't even get a look in.

The figures I quote are from Jan this year Tony and I received a mail last week saying we've sold our 100th Million device, I see figures every day for a specific carrier in the UK and Europe, in the UK we're seeing 3000 new connections each week for a single carrier in the UK so that's over 12,0000 across the big four plus Orange launched PAYG last week I think and they had 3000 connections in a single day! and this is just UK remember so it's looking healthy currently even with the economic downturn.

There's plenty of space out there for say 10 solutions, something like 96% of the worlds email has yet to be mobilised after all.

Plus I love seeing your replies as you probably do mine :D

so who has the biggest willy then? ;) :p

That, my friend, is marketing. Not technical functionality. SSL and IPSec tunneling ARE SECURE technologies. You're talking about a Govt approvals process that WM hasn't been through. Doesn't mean it's not secure technology however.


I'm going to ask our guys what our equivalent numbers are and see what I can publish.

You can't deny my technical arguments nor what I've seen in BB to WM migrations. Of course in your role I wouldn't think that you'd publicly acknowledge that though ;)