Ducati Sporting Club UK - What's your points? <--- That's cryptic ;o)

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- - What's your points? <--- That's cryptic ;o) (/showthread.php?t=17364)

Quote:

Originally posted by Desmondo
Ah, this is one of the reasons I decided not to join in with Desmo Due (apart from being a lazy git). When the series was first mentioned it sounded like a one make series which would be mainly based on rider ability. Buy a bike, stirp the lights off and race it. The more open the rules became, the less interest I had. And now the arguments are kicking off. I'll leave you guys to it :)

shame innit Jamie..... :(

Phil

Quote:

Originally posted by skidlids
You probaly could put the 620 engine in the 583 chassis but you would have to gut the lower brace bar just as you would to fit shorter inlet tracts. Not sure what total cost will be Jim at Bike Enders had a 5 speed engine with some damage for £375

Ok, my final word on the power and class debate!:

In an effort to put my money where my mouth is and prove that I'm convinced of the power defecit a 675 is suffering I've reviewed just about every option of fitting a 620 engine to my bike.

The only realistic way to get a 620 engine running is a 583 chassis is to ditch the fuel injection and most of the 620 electrics. Thankfully this is within the rules as carburation is free, but I'd love to have kept the throttle bodies, as carbs are much more expensive to set up and will require custom inlet manifolds.

The only exception to this is if you manage to get hold of a crashed-but-complete bike that still has the keys, ignition barrel, immobiliser, ECU, coils, reg/rect, etc, etc.... I've tried to find this lot and failed miserably. The general idea is that they would cost over £1k even if you could find them.

Even if you take the 620 with carbs route then you'll have to change the electrics and the l/h engine cover. Reliability may well be an issue and you'll end up chucking £200 on dyno
time to get the manifolds and jetting right.

It's a huge amount of work and expense for a low-budget team, and will only pay dividends if the club decides to allow 620 engines to have big bores next year. I can't afford it at the moment and, more importantly, have an engine that runs in bike that's handling ok. Any results I acheive will have to be based on that.

If the series doesn't expand into a bigger class next year then I can only hope the rules stay as they are and allow us to remain in the top half of the field.

Cheers,

Ali

ps: If one of the 620 boys would like to buy and use my 675 engine in their bike then I'll be more than happy to let it go for a reasonable price... say the £1000 it owes me! :lol:

583 prize

Thats because it was recognised that the 583s would be on a hiding to nothing against 620s and 674s, I must admit I am suprised at the lack of 583s out on the grid as they were the cheapest option to go racing and it was thought there would be more out there especially as figures of £900 were touted around as the price of a bigbore kit.
keep it cheap, keep it simple

Quote:

Originally posted by R1-ian

Quote:

Originally posted by domskidue

Quote:

Originally posted by dickieducati
never said it was a level playing field. what'd be the point everyone crossing the line at the same time?

That's not even the point.

The point is that we were told that a 675 would be a match for a 620 - fact!

Then it's down to rider ability, the point of the series - fact!

When a 620 is pulling 5 or 6 lengths on at fully sorted 675 down a 300 yard straight, it's not rider ability - fact!

Not everyone has the spare cash to buy a 620, so when we were told a 583 with BB would be a match, those with little cash, bought 583's.

When a true novice pulls away from me in a straight line, it's not coz he's better, it's coz he has a machine advantage.

I know some people think I'm full of <b>[Censored]</b> , but give me Geoff's bike and I'd lap as fast as him (not his week though).

So, now that we all know it's not a level playing field, how can you have a problem with seperate points?

It moves you up the table for a start!!!

This aint personal, I just feel like I'm talking to a wall :lol:

A faster rider should get past a novice on the bends and on the brakes....

my two team m8 last year both had better bike then me..one had a 15 bhp more then me,i'd still beat him in every race..

There is no such thing us a level playing field in racing..

some people cant buy a 620. some people cant buy good suspention for there 583....even if you had all 620 there will alway be people with better spec bikes..you will never stop it.......I'd thought this was going to be a freinds class..maybe this class should have just been for novices..

weeksy we will get the 620i. ;)

what about 2 riders or very simular or equal abilty on two bikes with 10 bhp at the rear wheel difference...only an idiot would believe the faster bike does not have an advantage.

do you guys miss the point............many of the 600ss people bought the bikes because a bb kit was avaliable to level the power output ..this is not the case..........simple as that.

Phil

Quote:

Originally posted by R1-ian
There is no such thing us a level playing field in racing..

some people cant buy a 620. some people cant buy good suspention for there 583....even if you had all 620 there will alway be people with better spec bikes..you will never stop it.......

Good points Ian, but this thread has been taken away from the point which was...

Should there be 2 (or 3) points tables.

We already know it's not a level playing field (as level as it could have been), so thats no longer an issue.

It's about accepting that there is now a race within a race.

Quote:

Originally posted by domskidue

Quote:

Exactly...................at last we get back to the point LOL...

Phil

Quote:

Originally posted by weeksy
Win because you are the best.... and prove all the others wrong....

So would Geoff have won on a 583 then?

No.

Would he have won on a 675?

No.

Simple!!

Quote:

Message original : domskidue
It's about accepting that there is now a race within a race.

I hope you don't mind if we use the same track ?? :lol::lol:

Quote:

Originally posted by Tonio600

Quote:

Message original : domskidue
It's about accepting that there is now a race within a race.

I hope you don't mind if we use the same track ?? :lol::lol:

Only if you dont get in the way...................l:P

Phil

But do you really want to be in a championship of only 11 bikes...thats what it would be if you've had your own class of 583....

I'd no someone who just got a 3rd place in the MRO AT CROFT on a nearly standard k3 1000 165 bhp...where most of the other bike are over 180 bhp and ex work bikes....

are you all saying that if you've had a 620 you would of beaten Geoff...may he is just a better rider....

do you really think it would be better for DSC to run two classes...cant you just do some head work on the big bored to make them work..