DesmoDue rent a bike ????????????
 

Ok, heres a slightly crazy idea that occured to me recently.

Fingers crossed that DD continues into 2006, lets assume that someone has had their fun and wants to sell a DD bike.

How about the DSC actually buying a DD bike to 'rent' out to members to really 'have a one-off go' at racing?????

This is really sparked by Weeksy's very valid debate about the HIGH cost of going racing. I'm sure the DD series is beyond the budget of 95% (?) of members.

Having started the ball rolling though - there are obvious drawbacks:

1) what if the bike got damaged / written off?
User pays for damage?
Insurance of some sort??
or plead with the DSC masses for the parts - I'm sure it would have to be something really bad before it could not be sorted by the skills that are available in the DSC.

2) I imagine there might well be a finanical 'loss' with this idea, even if it was ran for one season and the bike sold off (having had two years of being thrashed? - or ridden 'quickly' as the ad. might say).
But - if there was enough members wanting to ride the bike, at every round, would not serving the needs of the members be justification.

3) Would enough members go for it?
Would someone do all the training and get a licence.
Get all the leathers / kit.
Stump up the entry and travelling and accomodation fees,
just for one or two races???

I think I'd be tempted !

Just some food for thought guys - the floor is open:

Cheers - Frank

ps - Off to Florida on Sat. - so go and get those Ebay goodies ;)

is that a queue I see forming;)

Still waiting for Ray to get his finger out!:D;)

great idea in principle, and no reason why not but have be well thought out.

how about a fee to use the bike say 50 or 100 quid per meeting just to cover a bit of cost/depreciation. still very reasonable.

but as you say would people go through getting a licence for just one meeting?

i would say to anyone go for it.

A very good idea I think in principle, as it would allow people like Chi to have had a go without having to lay out £3000 or whatever, to then find out it's not really for him.


Not sure about either of those ideas. I don't know if 700 DSC members would be happy to pay £5 extra so that 6 or 8 members could go racing???

Likewise, the racers paying £5 a meeting extra to fund someone else racing against them. I think it's expensive enough as it is.

However, if you charged £100 or so to rent a DSC race bike, then you have the people directly affected paying for the privelidge, and after 2 years, the bike would have paid for itself?

It costs £200-£300 to rent a R6 for the day, so £100 for DD is a bargain ;)

£100 might be a bit cheaper than poss' if that includes tyres etc!

true - but if it's hot at Snet! And would you want to be the one doing the 4th meeting?

Have you been listening to the conversations that we've been having in the BHC and Bucks/Northants regions?

On Tuesday evening we met up for an evening rideout, and the conversation went along these lines. Now we (the DSC) know that there is enough interest in DD as a series the thought of having a hire bike (or bikes) that people could rent for the whole season or for just a single round would be much more feasible since grid slots are filled and interest in a hire bike would be better (although let's not forget that Louigi offered to build a hire bike and got little interest for this year). Actually, the conversation got around to the notion that running the series along the lines of the R6 cup where entrants paid a hire fee per entry and got a bike from a pool of identically prepared bikes would put an end to the 620 vs Big Bore kit debate....but that's a different story.

Yesterday, Fil2, Firefly, Fordie, Glyn and me got daydreaming about putting together a BHC bike as a regional entry, splitting the cost and have maybe 4 people run the bike as a syndicate, each competing in a round....more food for thought. Actually, it was just me and Glyn doing the daydreaming, cos Fil, Firefly and Fordie are already involved and are competing, but they were egging us on.

The hire bike idea is intruiging but there would need to be some control as Weeksy suggests. The DD series was originally supposed to be about the club members, so although I wouldn't want it restricted to newbie racers (funnily enough, the likes of me and Glyn as Weeksy suggests) I would want to restrict entry to people who had been a DSC member for at least a year to prevent the club being cynically exploited by people who would only join up to hire a bike, race a couple of times then sod of.

The other thing to bear in mind is that even though people would have to get ACU licenses and might be quickish on trackdays, you would effectively be dumping completely green small fry into a tank full of sharks once the present DD'ers have had a whole seasons experience of hard race moves.

[Edited on 10-6-2005 by Jools]

WHat if you get multiple people wanting to ride - would you draw lots?Tricky if you get your licence etc for £150+ then can't get the "rent-a-bike" to race...

funny that, JPM and I were talking about how we could get a NWregion member out there.

This whole DD thing just gets harder to resist - anyone want to swap their 620ss for a 900? no no no I must resist!!!!!!

How much does a 620 actually cost to make? £2,500? £3,000 maybe?

If Ducati UK supplied 36 identical bikes, and it cost £2,500 for 8 meetings, plus a £1000 deposit for crash damage, I think you'd still get a full grid.

Ducati would get shed loads of publicity, and everyone would have an equal chance.

I'm sure Ducati could gain enough interest from another big company to back the series, to make up for any shortfall.

It costs £300 a meeting as it is, almost. So £400 for an equal bike gets my vote. Although people like Louigi won't get to show their skills and bike prep.

Actually, thats a crap idea :lol:

:o:o:o:o:o:o:o:o

lets have a DSC raffle

2000 plus members, say you sell 1000 tickets at a fiver each £5k

6 prizes only - comprising

paid for ACU/New Era licence and membership
1 race entry
free bike use on the day

The math-

ACU/New Era stuff £140x6 = £840
Race entries £100x6 = £600

leaves £3.5k to buy, prep and run a bike for the year

bit tight - up the ticket price by a pound or two -

obviously I would'nt buy one (unless the DSC bike is better than mine) but for everyone else - fair game and no-one argues over who gets the ride

in fact, anyone want to ride #65 for the day next year, £10 a ticket, restricted to the first 1000 entries :eureka::eureka:

£100 per meeting to race on "equal" machinery with Weeksy and Domski!?! :P Anybody wanna buy my 583? :devil:

Not after Weeksy's broken it :P:P:P:P:P

no worries there, I'm only giving him one spark plug :frog:

if it were 100 pounds per race day I'd probably take it for the season.

Good!

I'm glad to see there are plenty of good ideas being kicked about and its also nice to see other sections are thinking along the same lines hopefully, with members interested as well.

Great debate as well...excellent that people are trying to think of answers / workarounds for the negative issues - I like it !!!

Frank

i think the way its going you want to worry about getting a place on the grid. its going to be busy busy busy next season i recon.

True, but if any entrepreneurial types fancy running a bike for me!! :devil:

dont really think it will be an issue in reality, but i understand that this years entrants have priority for next years grid

Sorry boys,

But the chance of this one flying is about as likely as the last living Dodo being found on Madagascar.

The prospect of the Club taking on that sort of financial layout for minimal return and with a high chance of it getting completely trashed (ok written off in an accident) is a non starter.

On top of that there is the liability issue, someone comes off and claims the bike had a fault, who cops for the blame?

If a group of people want to do this then fine but the Club cant go near it.

furry muff.................................

but as you say if a region or 2 got a bike together for say 6 different riders to share it would be great.

True, but if any entrepreneurial types fancy running a bike for me!! :devil: [/quote
Iwould but not at £100 per race!!!!!

weeksy you sure you dont descend from baldrick (blackadder)??????


"master, i have a cunning plan................"

[Edited on 10-6-2005 by dickieducati]

This was kicked around by the MT before the series got off the ground, but as well as the financial and liability aspect as Chris has pointed out there is the preparation and storage aspect to consider as well. To make it work you would need to have someone from the club able and prepared to build and maintain a bike, transport it to meetings, make sure it's on good rubber etc, then be prepared to fix it when someone has thrown it into a barrier? Not really a realistic prospect, and to have one of the dealers do this would cost a fortune. From memory the cost to entrants for the Monster S4 series was £6-8000 which included the cost of all entries and the use of the bike-but you didn't get to keep the bike. If you wanted the bike at the end of the year the cost was £15,000.

John

AK I have discussed getting a 2nd bike to run alonside Mrs Snot next year.............

At present, 2 very good mates are riding the one bike, and AK does all the fettleing (which is what he enjoys doing)

4 of us put our heads together (AK, myself, Mark & Andy) & agreed who pays for what before we got underway for the season
.
For those who dont race, its not just the:

ACU
Bike
& 'racing bits' for the bike - spares, susp etc

but:

the entry for the bike at the meeting (more if doing another series like SOT) usually £90 - £100 for the meeting
Fuel to get the bike there in the van/car & trailer
Fuel to race with
consumables for the bike
grub for all who go (booze too!:o )
Tyres

possible time off work if wanting to do ACU day, the day before the meeting

then comes the 'who pays for what' if it gets dropped, shoved off, hammered into something, or the mechanics of it fail.

All above need to be taken into consideration (and I've prob missed things too)

C

Hmmmmmmm....fair enough from the DSC point of view (I had a feeling litigation might be a sore point, somehow).

Oh, well - time for a consortium to get sorted NOW and save pennies / sort responsibilities ready for next year then.

It was an interesing Friday afternoon talking point anyway and shows interest in DD is still as high as ever.

Toys away ;)

Cheers - Frank

Agreed - cost me £370 last weekend for 15 laps :o

( P thankful for a big spending limit on Visa) :lol:

Steve,if you just look at the finance side its going to cost a lot more than £100 per race.
new 620 monster fully prepped £5000,assume sale at end of season £4k.
So assumming interest of 5% =£250.

Loss on bike £1000+£250= 1250 8? races=£156per race

Add to that tyres,fuel etc (without entrys) +labour to prepare bike i'm sure you would be on the wrong side of £350 per race.

But then if you look at it i suppose £2500 for 8 "turn up and ride" races proberbly isnt that bad.
Then again add entry fees etc and its not so good
Butch

I think this is a gagging idea Ironic. I cant afford to race, main thing I cant afford is the Bike, unless I sell the road going 996, & that aint gona happen. But this idea is great. Racer for a day, that would put a smile on my face.
Hope this idea go's somewhere.

Craig

what about the safety issue of having riders turn up for a " ride a race bike for a day " mixed in with others that have been racing for 6 or 7 meetings......its not like starting a race series and growing as a rider with each race meeting....to jump in for one race meeting would be imho potentially dangerous.!......its not a track day out there and the two are a WORLDS apart.
You only have to ask the DD racers now the difference between track and race days....its a massive and very steep learning curve. I can highlight many instances over the 2 race meets already where inexperince has caused " offs " can you imagine if at every meeting we had potential 1 off novice's turning up...........................

The idea of two racers sharing a bike for the season for the DD and the SoT is a valid and prooven idea..ie chris wood.

Not being a killjoy but it is a serious issue out there in a race.

Phil



[Edited on 14-6-2005 by fil2]

sorry guys, couldt think of a worse way to use DSC funds. I for one would not vote for any of the DSC cash being spent in this way. If there is spare cash, and we/MT cant think of a 'reasonable' way to use it, then reduce my membership cost please;)

If you want to get racing on the cheap, and only do a few rounds, get together as Jools suggests above and do it that way, share the costs and take it in turns to ride.

I think Phil has a validish point regarding new peolpe each round, but then most are new this year so shouldnt be that much of an issue unless 1/2 the grid do this.

to be fair you dont have to be a novice to cause an "off". there are people in every series up to motogp level who tend to have more incidents than others and im sure come the end of the year ours will be no different. to have a few novices in each race shouldn't cause a problem some would say it makes more sense than how we started DD. 20 odd novices at woodland!

Felix,

Just seen this.
My finger is staying where it is:P

Like Monty & Chris say

Ducati did this with the monster series a while ago, pay up and ride was the deal and the bikes got sold off via dealers.

I agree that the Club shouldn't do it, there all sorts of issues if it goes all Pete Tong?

I thought Lougi had put a hire bike together? or has Domski bagged that for the season?

There is already a big difference speedwise in this series, more so than on any trackday group IMHO.

Ray

even motogp riders get lapped.

I can't see this being a real safety issue as it happens in every other race class I know of with clubs like New Era and North Glos, There is nothing to stop a first time novice entering SoT, F600 or Powerbike on the last day of the season.
In the not to distant future I hope to have a 2nd bike ready for the grid and will look at getting another DSC member or two out there on it.

The point i was making is that a novice joins then gains experience as the meetings progress throughout the year..........in the case of " rent a race bike " the novice would do one race !! with no experience of the environment they are jumping into. Of course we are all novices when we start out but we continue to gain experience as we do more races and not stop after 1 race.! which would be the case here...i can just forsee issues over the idea..its a great idea in theory but in practise would create many many problems.

Im not against the idea of sharing a bike at all, but the idea of rent a race bike for a day worries me...

Phil

[Edited on 14-6-2005 by fil2]

Litigation, litigation & litigation.....

like i said before -great idea to have people 'having a go', BUT please think of the potential for who may get 'kicked' if the bike is found to have any mech probs etc causing a crash & the like - this is why the club cannot do it - and anyone thinking of trying it MUST sign paperwork to waive any liabilitys etc - or their family might do this after an 'event'

C