999s dyno run done....toys out of pram time!!!!!
 

finally got my 999s dyno'd. it has full 54mm termi's and 14t front with slipper otherwise standard. realsitically was looking for 130+ at back wheel. it came out at 120!:mad::mad::mad:
crank figure was 130 which is 6 down on stated figure for a standard bike. now i know dyno's vary etc etc but surely it should be chucking out more than this. the whole reason i paid out £1500 quid was to get more power for track days and i seem to have ended up with less! unfortunately i didnt have it done before the cans went on so dont know if it was poor before or just as a result of the cans.
spoke to ducati ashford where i bought it and as it happens there was a guy there from ducati who was asked what i should be expecting. he basically gave it the "different dyno's, looser engines, ram air" blah blah blah. im no dyno expert but there is clearly something wrong when other 999s's with similar set ups are producing at least 10bhp more. i asked what they could do about it and he basically said if i want it taking back to original cans, tested, then new cans put back, and tested to try to find the problem then it would be at my own cost!.
:mad::mad::mad:
if i wasnt happy i would have to write to ducati uk (which i most certainly will be).
i'm well fed up, am i being overly sensitive here?

Yes, you are being overly sensitive!

If you really feel that strongly about it, book some dyno time with another place that uses a different kind of dyno. You will then get another set of figures which will probably give you your 130bhp at the back wheel.

Unfortunately dynos will all read differently due to calibration differences, and bikes will also read differently too.

However, I would consider putting the original kit back on to get your baseline figure and then work from there. You may find a little tweak here and there will give you the results you're looking for, but don't expect instant results.

Let's face it - 130bhp at the crank is still pretty awesome and 120 at the rear is plenty!

i hear what you are saying but i dont just want 130 so i can brag about it, that is what the bike should be pumping out. it was done on the same dyno i used for my 916 which was also run on a different one with identical figures so i would say it was fairly consistent. they also had runs from a 998s (esentially the same engine as mine) and that had 136 on thier dyno!.
120 is ok but those pesky gixer thou's will still leave me for dead on the straights at brands. (or maybe thats just because im crap!) anyway have written to ducati to moan so will see what comes of it.

Good luck - you may well have a friday afternoon bike that only needs a few tweaks from Ducati !

now let me see.... 130 - 120 = 10 x £10 =

... Thatll be £100 please mate?

Who did you get the dyno done by and on what type of dyno(Dynojet, DynoDynamics, Superflow etc)?
Have they got info available for dyno numbers on their dyno for 999, 998, 998S GSXR750 or GSXR1000?
You have learnt the first lesson of performance tuning. Get a baseline first. Depending on the dyno, with 54mm Termis you should be seeing 132-140hp at the rear wheel. With a PCIII you should be able to get to 145hp.
Unless the dyno operator is a goose, you definately have a problem, a standard 999 with asymetrical Termi's produces more power than this.

it was on a fuchs dyno at ron parkinson in marks tey. not a top tuning specialist to be fair. depending what ducati say may have to pay myself to get it taken back to original and start a fresh with a baseline as you say. lesson learnt. i am no expert but thier seems to be so much confusion over getting the best set up. i guess a lot of it is subjective. they said for a start a power comander wouldnt make a difference!

Commander doesn't make a difference???
Hows this:
Baseline is standard bike, it's all PCIII from there.

The graph you show says a std bike is more powerful than one fitted with termi's and ECU - have I read that right?

No
Testing was done with two ECU's 999 Termi and 999S Termi. The 999 Termi ECU produced better power and is what is used in all three graphs shown.

Like jk2, I am confused by your graph. the blue graph is the most powerful one, measured at 138.6 bhp, but the legend above the chart says blue is std ECU rear cyl, run #078. Is this just a colour mix up?

No there is no mix up. This is the dyno for my "old" bike. It started as a 999 producing 118hp at the rear wheel.
I then added the asymetrical Termi, slipper clutch, alloy flywheel, carbon plates and most importantly 996R cams.( this is the same part # as 998S & 999S cams) as well as a power commander.
The bike was running very lean with the 999 termi (standard) ECU. I also had a 999S Termi ECU, which was tested and should have, theoretically, produced the most power as the bike was ostensibly a 999S. Theory didn't translate to reality and the 999 Termi (standard) ECU produced the best power curve, so it was left on the bike. I subsequently (3 weeks ago) traded the bike on a 999S and am using th lessons learned to develop something really special.

Dickieducati
Forgot to mention in my last post, you may remember that I mentioned a friends 999S with 54mm Termi's dropped in power on the dyno from 136 to 128hp after a cam timing change. As I said, I wasn't convinced that it wasn't fuelling and I may still be right and a PC may sort the problem, but changing the cam timing around 2 degrees fixed the problem. So cam timing appears to be absolutely critical.

cheers, your info has been really useful, i wont be able to get mine set up for a couple of months now but will let you know all the details when john hackett is let loose on it.

aerodynamics
 

I would like to introduce a different slant to all this power talk and tell you that it's pointless anyway. Last years trip to wdw on the old style bike saw cruising speeds between fuel stops of anything up to 160mph. tucked behind the screen and no problems at all. On the new bike I have now your top speed is governed by how well you can hang on. Although I can hit a indicated 159 down the back straight at snetterton the problems dont show themselves because you are too busy. BUT sit on a foreign motorway and try this and you will find that the aerodynamics will not allow such speeds, the sides of the fairing where the foils are will flap and the top locating lugs will come adrift. Even laying on the tank you are hit so hard by the blast....... I didn't notice all this on the tracks or on UK roads but this years trip to spain showed it up. And you need not waste time and energy with ducati UK, they just say that nobody else has had a problem. The only person that has a problem is Neil Hodgson, he has a higher and wider fairing that no doubt works. He has even discussed it in MCN. But I get nowhere.
One p***ed 999 owner.

Buy a double bubble screen. I am 5'11" and ride my bike regularly at 150+mph at Phillip Island race track with no such problems or concerns.

Fit a DP race screen. Works for me:biaggi:

screen
 

when I bought the bike the only screen I could find was the skidmarx one. And yes it does keep wind of the head but its not wide enough, wind is directed down the side of the bubble onto your shoulders. What sugestions do you have to stop the side panels from trying to take off. I have talked to many manufactureres about possible replacements, but they are all cloning the standard kit, which is lacking.

Enough of screens - back to power debate. I have a 999s. Just fitted the 50mm termi system with the new ECU supplied in the kit. Clearly the engine is breathing a lot better (no restriction in exhaust) but I am not convinced there is any more power over the standard system, having ridden the bike several times. I will spend some time verifying this on a dyno when I get some time. If this is the case, it is a pretty poor show from Ducati having shelled out £850 for no power gain.

The fix lies in the fuelling and/or ignition map. Wild cams are not the answer for a road bike - which mine is.

Can anybody reccommed a good Ducati tuner who can set up a power commander on a 999s, and finish the job that Ducati didn't!!

Interestingly, when I first rode the bike with the termis and ECU, my initial impression was over fuelling bogging the engine.

Is it an asymetric system that you have fitted (looks like the standard one , short u shaped pipe from rear cylinder) or a 50mm full system ? (completely differnt routing for the pipe from the rear cylinder)

Full systems are available in 3 sizes , 50mm , 54mm and 57mm dia , the 50mm one is NOT reccomended for the S , only for the standard 999 , if a dealer has sold you a 50mmsystem for an S take it back :(

Sorry , having read your post again I notice you say the pipes cost you £850 so it sounds like an Asymetric system you have bought , not sure exactly how much extra power you should get from that , it is definitley a lot lighter than standard (about half the weight :o ) ans sound much better though.

Full systems are supposed to increase power by approx 8% , hopefully someone else will be able to tell you if the Asymetric system gives as much or not :sing:

Base termignoni for 999s
 

JHP set up my 999s with the base termi system and it starts, runs, revs better and faster apart from sounding like a bike now. But I regret not going the whole way. I heard that the route to power is to fit the biggest system you can lay your hands on, clean up the ports and hey presto. Ducati London South claims that their racer with just that is making consistent 145 at the rear wheel. I don't know which dyno unfortunately.

In MCN this week Trevor Franklins long term 999S was dyno'd at 126.13bhp with the standard can/system.With the Termi can fitted,it made 128.00bhp.I guess it was the "standard" replacement can and not a big bore jobbie.
They reckon there is more to come as it was running lean from 4000rpm.

You should expect to see more than 2 hp gain from junking the v. restricitve original can to the free flowing termi system - (my system came with a larger diameter front pipe and is definitely for a 999S).

When you couple this with a new ECU, you would expect to see a noticeable difference.
Anyway enough whinging, it sounds fantastic, is the best built Ducati I've owned by far, and still goes like stink!!:rodent:

Men & motors to the rescue ????
 

Just seen bike shows UK where they stuck a 999 on a Dyno and got and average of 123 brake at the back wheel - hope this is some relief !

Regards - Frank

not really, mine is a 999s and getting 120 with full termi's.

Should have bought a yellow one :lol:

hardly, its bad enough only having 120!


anyway talk me through this yellow............................................ ......................................why?:frog:

well just look at this.......


http://www.aberdeenbikers.co.uk/gallery/745.jpg


that looks like at least 200 bhp and it's just sitting in the car park :lol:

maserati
 

I have a 999s and fitted the full 57mm system and ECU.

was disappointed when run on the Dyno to only reach 126bhp at the rear wheel, additionally I felt the midrange was running a bit lumpy.

I have now paid a visit to FW Developments in Preston, (home of the Monster Mob team) they really know what they are doing.

Fitted a PCIII and full rolling road set up.

Bike pulls amazingly now throughout the rev range, no lumpyness at all and bhp gain at top end to 134bhp and in some cases 10bhp increase in the mid range.

Bike rides totally different now and has the power to see of my mates R1.

Can definately recommend a visit to FW Developments.