Who's best to run DD - the DSC!
 

Now that I'm no longer on the Race Committee for the series, I can offer my opinion on here.

I resigned from the rider's rep role because I felt that personal agendas were directly driving the actions of those in positions of responsibility and I felt that these positions were being abused for personal gain.

It now seems that recent developments from outside of the RC are also being driven by personal agendas and politics.

I believe that for the greater good of the DD series, we should be managed by the DSC or their representatives, as long as these individuals do not demonstrate personal agendas.

I fear that any attempt to run the series by another party if handled incorrectly (which I believe the recent ones have) can only lead to disharmony and can potentially split the riders and ruin the series.

If personal agendas are not at play, then why can't these outsiders lobby the committee to demand that the changes in the way the series is run are delivered through the existing RC committee?

Or better still, ensure that the RC is made up of individuals who are nominated and voted in by the DD riders. The present RC can put themselves forward for election should they wish along with those that feel they can run it better.

Why wouldn't they - running the DD is what they want isn't it? Unless its just a ruse to attack certain individuals whilst hiding behind a supposed committee takeover play.

I worry that personal agendas may split the series and potentially end it if they are allowed to prosper. I'd like to see greater transparency in the activities of the RC and suggest again as above that its members are all voted in by the DD riders (and perhaps the DSC members).

Tim

You're right Tim. The ways and means are there to replace the RC should those rules be followed, and this underhand method of trying to drum up support and raise a lynch mob is just pathetic.

Ditto Tim.

FFS

You're da man Tim. I agree 100%.

Feel the DD love.

Agreed, Tim well said

well said!!!

What i've been saying for a couple of months now.

And if we'd had greater transparency and commitment to the 'series' all along then none of this would have happened!

I agree 100% the DSC should run DD but I think they should let New Era control it All the DD need is a riders rep to liaison with New Era we don't need the RC.

Nicely put Tim


I think the DSC members should have a say, turn the clock back two years, at that time there wasn't any DD riders only members of the DSC and its management team and from this the DD race series was born. Initial support came from DSC members signing up for the series late in 2004 which gave enough entrants for the organisers to approach various race bodies to enable the DD series to run.
The first ever DD race in 2005 put 30 bikes out on the grid at Cadwell, by the start of 2006 this figure had grown 47 bikes taking to the grid at Cadwell in March. Where to in 2007 ??

I would like DD to stay with the DSC in 2007 as well, but I have a problem with allowing the whole membership to vote on something that only affects about 35 of us.

DD may be a DSC event, but without the people who actually get out there and race, there is no series. Therefore I think it is only reasonable/sensible to allow those directly involved to decide their destiny, rather than the whole membership who won't be affected one way or another.

I doubt if many non-DD racers could care less about who runs it anyway.

I also think it would be too open to abuse or peer pressure if you allowed the whole membership to vote. At the risk of sounding controversial, I think there are lots of club members that would back MT members purely because they don't want to upset them.

Lastly, the RC members from 2005 and 2006 have proven that they are not the right people to run DD in 2007.

My view...

The DSC and the DD organisers (whover they are) need to run and control the series.
-including race formats / points / prizes / entry cirteria etc.

New Era put the races on for us.
- as they do for everyone else.

The series was intended to and should remain different from everyone / everything else. The same RC getting BAD press are also the ones who sorted a number of issues out this year for DD to run as smoothly as possible. Tyres, Assen, Donnington, Press coverage, guest riders.

As we have seen this year, we are just a small cog in the New Era wheel.

The riders working WITH people (DSC / DD / RC / Riders Reps / New Era) in this series is the way forward. NOT the constant battling between individuals who are self promoting / with alternate agendas / thinking they can and will do better than that person etc. / wanting to make a point etc. If the behaviour that has happened this year happened in a workplace people should be sacked....and I work in HR!

I joined DD to race with my DSC current and new mates in an enjoyable, fun and friendly series, just like 90% of the people involved. The other 10% can go and race Hysongogogo mobiles as far as I'm concerned and take the petty politics with them. It's not WSB people, in fact it's a relatively NOVICE CLUB series, get off your soap box and enjoy. If not go elsewhere PLEASE.

I'n not supporting the RC or the individuals concerned, I just have a long clear memory as to what this DD thing was all about...people seen to be forgetting that.

What I'm suggesting is not difficult and I have and will continue to support the DD series going forward in 2007 fomally or informally in any role.

Unless I really chuck it down the road at Cadwell and hurt myself....

Dom,

Without the DSC there would be no DD, there are lots of races annd racers out there.

Please show some respect for the efforts that have been made over the past two year to make the DD happen, sure things haven't been perfect. If you can't do that then stop publicly having a go at people.

Without the DSC run DD, you and the riders wouldn't have gone to Assen and you and Phil wouldn't have got a race series to win.

Fair points Dom, but to your last point, it could be argued that the series wouldn't have all that it does have (good and bad) without the RC members over the last 2 years. They haven't always done right in my opinion (that's why I resigned), but they have done a lot of good by getting the series going and to the point it is today. If we are allowed to vote (and I think it should just be the DD riders too), then we can decide whether those presently on the RC should remain.

Tim

I don't see what your getting at. I said I want DD to remain with DSC. I just don't see why EVERYONE should have a say on who or how it's run.


I think you'll find I'm often the first person to say when good things have been done. I'm also one of the first to point out when things are not being done. Respect goes both ways too.


I could have gone to Assen without DSC, and I could have won another race series without DD/DSC. That's not the point at all. I like DD & the DSC and I want it to be run the best it can be. So far, although certain things have been very good, I think a lot needs to be improved upon and I personally don't think the current RC are the right people to do it.

Can I not have a personal opinion now? or only if its all nicey nicey??

We could just sweep everything under the carpet, put our heads in the sand and pretend everything is perfect of course.

That's all I'm saying.

Why do you all read in to what I post and make out I hold some extreme view.

As I just said to Chris, I will always applaud the good work - which I have done, but I will also criticise when things are done poorly.

On balance, I think someone else should be given the opportunity to improve DD - unless nobody wants to do it.

Well, on this point, you have often shown the ability in your other postings to take an "extreme" view - nothing wrong with that, but don't be surprised if others may think that you hold "extreme" views on many subjects too...

Tim

Absolutely agree with Chris on this.....well said .................100%




Phil

I am Mr Unextreme :cool:

I can see that some things I say may be seen as over-enthusiastic, but...

"the RC members from 2005 and 2006 have proven that they are not the right people to run DD in 2007."

...isn't extreme is it?

Maybe it is :confused:

I was just about to agree with Dom's concerns over having the DSC rather than just the DD riders voting on DD matters when I remembered -

DD was intended as a series for DSC members to experience racing, NOT as a one-make series where the riders made the racing decisions themselves, while benefitting from someone else sorting out tyres, sponsorship, entry criteria etc

That said, the DD doesn’t always seem to have enjoyed the fullest support of some sections of the DSC membership or officaldom.......

I tend to support the view that sorting out the rules,venues,formats, grids etc should be done by representatives of the DSC before the start of the season and then a single person act as liasion with the race organiser (NE or whoever) and back into the riders and the DSC.

Then it is down to individuals to decide if they want to race under the rules and conditions available at the start of the year and join or not join the series accordingly.

There may well be minor changes to the odd round and while it can be a pain, it happens in pretty much all forms of competitive sport, motor or otherwise.

So to sum up, the people who have done the majority of the hardwork in the setting up of the series thus far are arguably the best people to take us into 2007, but perhaps a different personality is required for initially dealing with any issues arising during the season?

series going from strenght to strenght...!!...2 championships increased grid numbers...overseas round....Oulton park added as requested...tyre deal..shell oil pack....press coverage..!!.

All good things that the DD/RC have done.....

Sure there are " issues " that have arisen but are they not due to outside influences other than DD born......

Im not saying the RC are all brillaint and get everything right !!! how can they with 45 plus different views and opinions.? cos they are not...but better the devil.?...

edited to add and support Paul in VOTE CHRIS WOOD IN........................to work with along side the MT on the DD

I agree.
There is a lot involved in pinning down the details that should now be pretty much sorted - thanks from me to ALL involved for that work.
I was just trying to think out how to say we should think back to the reason it all started, and try and keep it simple, with no poncing around once the season has started.
Vote Chris Wood.

But he's a bloody Aussie!! - they'll be taking our jobs next!!! ;)

Seems to me like a co-ordinated effort from all sides is required to put this back on track.

There are so many opinions, he said, they said, he did, they did or didn't !

There are many issues, some should be considered, some should be moved on from.

The end result of all this arguing will only serve to alienate the membership further, put off riders from joining and ultiamtely see the series or a derivitive of possibly being taken an advantage of by another club.

There are and have been serious issues raised this year - last year was teething issues, this year have been ones that should NEVER have happened - but they did. So now is the time to make sure they don't happen again and everyone puts the effort in to secure 2007.

Hindsight !!

Personally I think a meeting at Cadwell is a good idea - however please leave your handbags hanging on the handlebars and lets try and make the series something EVERYONE involved with can be proud of.

Did we not all say the same things 12 months ago?

im interested to understand what these serious issue's are.?......

dont answer if its gonna go all " defcon 1 "....lol

These kinds of issues Phil. :)

i agree 100%.........................

i cant do smileys will this do ;-)

If i recall correctly there were similar manouverings going on then.

I fail to see the logic.

It should be something everyone is proud of - riders, representatives and club members, instead it's a joke.

Everyone has made an effort in some way, spent cash, time and added their commitment at a level they saw fit.

Some used it as a means to get something, though i fail to see what, out of it. Majority enjoyed it, were passionate about it, and hopefully still are.

I've no wish to blame anyone specific here - but folks wake up huh - see whats happening here - Do you want this to happen again next year ?

What an excellent thread.

As a member of the MT who does not have any 'official' involvement with DD, it's very heartening to see the support that exists for the DSC continuing to run the series and some recognition for the hard work that has been put in to get the series to where it is today.

I know that some mistakes have been made, some of them thumping great big ones, but that just goes to show that human beings with all their faults are involved.

From my point of view running the DD series splits into several areas that all require attention and some improvement. Just as in any business there is the day to day operational management (ie: the nitty gritty of organising the events and schedules, communicating the same to riders and remembering the damned trophies to name but a few tasks) this role should be to ensure that all riders have to worry about is turning up and racing - I used to compete in international rallies and I know theres enough for a competitor to do without having to worry about what the event arrangements are. The way I see it, whoever does this role (whether it's the RC or an individual) and the riders themselves have absolutely the right to have the most involvement in this aspect. Same goes for sponsors.

I'm speaking for myself here not as an MT representative, but I think that DD should be one of the flagship activities of the club and it is important enough (in my view) to have a dedicated MT 'role' devoted to the running of DD. It would not be fair to dump that volume of work on one individual, so I would also like to see a structure of volunteers who would assist the MT role but not necessarily have any say in how the series was run.

So the MT role would do all of the operational management, liaising with New Era, Riders and Sponsors (making sure that the sponsors relationship with the DSC was equitable). maybe they wouldn't do all that themselves but they would be accountable to all of the above for the successful day to day operation.

In the same way, that MT member also needs to be accountable to the MT and MOST IMPORTANTLY to the membership of the club. On an operational basis that needs to be the case so that any money spent on DD (which of course belongs to all the members) can be justified and spent with required approval.

As far as the membership of the DSC is concerned I think that it IS a DSC series and therefore EVERY member should be entitled to a view of what DD is all about and how their money is spent in it's support.

I'm not advocating that we run a poll for every member on every decision, that would plainly be ridiculous, that's why I'm suggesting that the full time MT member should be elected for that purpose and given the mandate to make 'day-to-day' operational decision by the membership.

What I am suggesting is that the full membership should have a mechanism by which their suggestions and voice about the strategic direction of DD can be heard and considered. That is all I've ever advocated. Some type of suggestion box, if you will, that can be periodically considered by a DD comittee (chaired by the DD MT member) so that everyones input can be fairly evaluated, decisions made and the results of those decisions communicated.

I don't know precisely how this would work but I believe that if this governance structure was put in place it would give the members a chance to voice their ideas about whether the strategic direction of DD was in line with the aims and values of running the club in the first place. Clearly, DD as it now stands is consistent with those aims (as spelled out in the club constitution) but we do need some form of governance structure that ensures that DD remains consistent with those aims. For example, if we turned round and said "OK, this years DD effort is to spend the clubs entire reserve on doing all the GP circuits in the world" that would be stupid and I believe it IS the whole mebership who need to apply a sanity check to the strategic thinking behind DD.

If we do this with the right mechanisms and in a clear, open and honest way I believe that we can give the riders and sponsors the respect they deserve for their financial and time commitment and ensure that the members have their say as well. What members don't want to see IMHO is the riders electing themselves as some type of elite echelon of the DSC and cutting them out of the decision making loop

Wow, I never knew that... you can press the space bar to page down the thread!
Every day's a school day!

So you only have to press the space bar 10 times to skip my posts then ;)

I found your post very interesting Jools.

SO how do you page up then:D

press the 'Page Up' button!

so if a " DSC" member but not a DD racer?sponsor has an opinion or an idea then that has to be listened to by the MT/RC even though they have not directly supported the DD other than with there 25 quid membership fee...?


From what i understood no club funds have ever been used to set up DD.!

ANY ideas should be considered by the MT/RC shouldn't they?
You never know, it might be a good idea.

To easy

I suggest Nick wears a dress for the entire Cadwell Meeting when not on the track :D

Votes ?

I like your post Jools and agree with everything you say (I think)


I have no problem in the general DSC membership having views and opinions, in fact everyone should be encouraged to express ideas and suggestions.

I just think it's a bit unfair to have the general membership 'voting' on things that only affect the racers, like "Which person should run the series?" or "How many rounds should there be?" etc etc


Totally agree.

Does anyone know how much of the club funds are actually used for DD?

I also get the impression that some members think that DD is laid on for us for free, and they get the hump coz some of us complain sometimes. Perhaps something can be published to clear that up? It's cost me over £3500 (of Domski money) this season and I've not had to buy a bike AND I have good sponsorship too! Some people have spent £10,000+

This isn't a DSC jolly.

:)

I think a couple of hundred quid was used early September!!!!