Radial Brake conversions
 

In the 2004 Demon Tweeks catologue they have radial brembo brake conversion kits for £480 doesn't say exactly whats included but from the pic, you get the brackets that bolt on to original showa fork bottoms and brembo radial 4-pad calipers good price if this is right.

They also have replacement radial fork bottoms for showa forks, no price though.

Cheapest way ive seen so far to get radials,:D:D:D

~Thanks

Lee1980 ;)

[Edited on 27-1-2004 by Lee1980]

Sounds a bit too cheap to me.....
 

....maybe it doesn;t include the calipers?

I reckon you're looking at £1500 - £2000 for the mod, but if I'm wrong, I'll be very happy!!!!

Tim:frog:

The radial 4 Pad calipers are about £250 from motowheels.com, so i reckon the kit does include the calipers - wonder how much it is for the ohlins version though? :(

Dont you also need the smaller disks to get the full benefit? Add another £400 to the bill!

The pic in the cat, shows a bracket made to bolt on the standard showa bottoms and this leaves a big gap with the caliper out further, so maybe more likely to flex thus out weighing one of the benefits of radials.

Maybe the only way is to change the fork bottoms for the big chunky cnc machined ones they have in the bottom pic, prabably a £1000 + £500 for calipers, not so cheap:devil::devil:

Thanks

Lee1980;)

Radial Conversion
 

Have a look at : -

http://www.rsvr.net/pages/specialoff...bsection=&c=17

OK, they're for Aprilia Mille R so I'm not sure they'll be a straight swap depending on the type of Ohlins you have, but at £999 + VAT including calipers and pads that gives you an idea...

Alternatively, find a breaker who has an '03 RSVR - there were plenty around and all had radial calipers with the correct discs fitted to their Ohlins forks as standard.

Happy hunting!

Clippy

Don't want to piddle on the fireworks, but is it really worth it?

Even journalists, whose reson for being is to hype up anything new and sexy, are saying that radials offer virtually no advantage over something like Brembo 'pad per piston' brakes unless your name is Bayliss.

Seems like a lot of money to pay for fashion

Couldn't agree more, Jools. But, hey, to each their own...

I'm not convinced that a converter is really going to do the job anyway...

The reason for using radial is that it eliminates the flex in the normal mounting points. If all you're doing is adding a converter to this, that mounting point will still exist and, in theory, so will the flex. You'll just be transmitting the flex down the caliper and the converter to the mounting point.

£500 quid sounds "reasonable" for radial mount calipers and the converters, but I'd spend the extra and get the proper fork bottoms rather than converters.

Whether you'd notice the difference is another matter, but if you can notice a difference between the standard Brembo calipers and the 4-pad ones, then I'm sure you would notice the difference in radial too.

Besides, if they didn't work then nobody would be using them, right?

Interestingly, I read in this month's Motorcycle Racer magazine that Sir Alan of Cathcart really rates the Braking Wave disks, especially the new "Bat Flight" ones. Maybe this would be a better (and cheaper) upgrade option if you want more braking power?

It's fashion. Period.

First, Antonye is correct that a converter is silly. Since it adds another link in the system, it actually increase flex.

Now assuming you are after reducing the flex and that is your argument for wanting radial brakes, keep in mind that you won't be able to feel any flex with road tyres and your standard caliper mounts. The wheel will lock before you get any flex in your caliper mounts. The reason they had to improve the caliper mounts is that race tyre technology has progressed so rapidly in recent years.

So, if performance is really the main argument, you'll only get that benefit if you are running race slicks and are braking much harder than you ever thought possible.

Lastly, look at the radial mounts on most new road bikes. They are no improvement on flex to the standard setup. The reason people say its better is simply because the advances in calipers, discs, and pads. Not because it's radial.

[Edited on 29-1-2004 by Felix]

I reckon the best way to go would be to get the standard mounting "R" spec 4-pad calipers, and the matching discs - I got my calipers for 170-ish i think, complete with Carbone Lorraine SBK pads - f*ck me they make a huge difference! A lot more feel, and its perfect for lazy gits like me who only use two fingers to brake! :lol:

Anthony.....
 

........there is a huge difference between the 4-pad (per caliper) calipers and the 2 pad ones.

If the radial caliper mounts made that much difference again I'd be truly amazed and would buy them immediately.

I have to say that I was tempted to look at the radial route, but the money could be much better spent on other goodies!!

It also seems that with the waveys fitted to the new Kwaka, they're back in fashion too!!

Tim

Better........
 

Tim:frog:

[Edited on 29-1-2004 by Rattler]

Stoppit Tim, you're just showing off now....

:frog:

Tim,

That mate of mine at Oulton had the full Brembo/JHP conversion, think the CNC fork bottoms were in excess of £700, the brake lines alone were over £400, I think he got a bit of a deal, as he knows Mark Griffiths pretty well (Renegade boss), think the whole setup cost him just over 2K, using some of their unused calipers/discs etc, should be about 3k I reckon.

Saying that they maybe for sale, as he has just replaced that 996R with a brand new 998F02 race bike, still in the crate, don't even want to guess the cost of that thing !:o

JP
 

When you say replace, I bet he hasn't got rid of the 996R, he's probably just stuck it next to his other one in his front room!!

Tim :frog:

I just spotted those carbon rims as well Weeksy ...

Tim, You have too much money and you live in a mansion ..... Weeksy tols me so ...!!!

:frog:

Its all thanks to Father Christmas!!!
 

The Wheel Man strikes again. You told me thay were cabon/mags at the AGM but they look like full cabon in the pic. Don't tell me this is yet another different set :lol:

With all those spares you've got now surely you can do me a cheap set :D :frog:

If a radial conversion is gonna make the brakes any better than the four pad set then its gonna tip you straight over the handlebars as soon as you touch the brakes!!

I must admit that I have lusted after some sort of radial brake conversion but as my arms can only stand about 7 or 8 attempts at Mansfield (Cadwell) anything more than the four pad set is no more than eye candy!!

Ray

Nah.....
 

....they are carbon and magnesium, but the centres were gold (yuk), but have been painted black.

I do have some wheels that you may be interested in these are the OZ beauties;



My latest wheels are in fact these;



Tim:frog:

Weeksy - sorry mate, must have missed your call....
 

........I thought you were just ignoring me!!

The OZs are for sale, I'm gonna stick 'em on ebay in a few weeks, once the weather picks up and everyone's looking forward to racing/trackdays and thinking about bits they'll need.

Tim:frog:

radials
 

i rode my mates 999r and compaired to mine the initial bite was much better

Nathan....
 

....which calipers are you using?

Tim:frog:

Forget the OZs
 

...tell me about the DR supermoto wheels!

Have you been out on it yet? on/off road?:roll:

Rattler
 

hi rattler
i have the normal 999s 4pad calipers but so far ive tried lucas RSQ AND CRQ mixture
and the sintered ebc pads still not as good as the standard 999r for inital bite and power (less power needed at the brake lever )

Harv.........
 

...........only been out a few times on the road, its a great laugh though.

I'm hoping to get off-road this weekend, so far the most its been offroad is when I park it on the kerb!!!

I'm having some issues with gearing for the supermoto wheels, but I'll get there.

Nathan - what's the difference between the brakes on the 999S compared to the 999R apart from radials and about £700!!!


Tim:frog::frog:

radials
 

after riding both bikes, same track same day after 20 mins on each 999s-999r the difference was clear to see my arms were not as pumped on the R as i didnt have to use as much front brake lever pressure for the same braking effect, infact i could brake a little later . both bikes had new brake fluid and fairly new pads and the same suspension setup .
:saint:

You\'re a lucky man being able to swap between the two!!
 

...are the master cylinders the same too?

Tim:frog:

they both have the new radial master cylinder from brembo (standard size) but over the winter weve both fitted the 19mm radial (complete nightmare to fit )
a friend of mine has bought the 46 mm öhlins front end for his 998rs(was a superstock bike with standard forks)
now that would be interesting tohave a go on.......:devil:

Would the Brembo 2-piece billet GP calipers (2 Pad) be better than the new Brembo P4 Calipers (4 Pad)?
The 40mm GP calipers are what entry-level race teams use......and I was thinking of getting a pair and mating with billet radial lever.
IMHO The GP calipers look much better than the P4's...

Rattler, werent those carbon DyMags formerly on a MultiStrada......?

cheers.
D

Dazza......
 

.........I don't know about the Billet 2 pad jobbies against the 4 pad OEM ones, Felix or Skidlids may know this one.


As for the Dymags, they were wasted on a Multistrada, but it does mean that I have a Multistrada adapter and axle so that the OZs can be fitted to a MS if anyone's interested?



Tim:frog:

RADIALS
 

The billet 2 pad calipers are at least as good if not better than the 4 pad calipers. Plus, they're about half the weight so reduce unsprung weight.

There are quite a few different options for going radial. If you have Ohlins R&Ts then you can replace the caliper mount which bolts onto the fork bottom with a radial mount version circa £700. If you have Showa forks then you can replace with PVM radial fork bottoms and both K-Tech and JHP do radial fork bottoms for Showa as well. All priced at around a grand!

However, your problems (financial!) have only just begun. All of the above conversions are designed to be used with race calipers (whether they be Brembo, AP, PVM etc). All the race calipers use 108mm mountings (i.e. 108mm between centres of caliper mounting bolts). The Brembo radial calipers on the 999R, Aprilia RSVR etc have 100mm mountings so they won't fit! Also, Brembo race radial calipers retail for around £1200 each!!!!

Your other option would be to speak to someone like Roy at Polygon Engineering who will make you (and fit) a pair of radial mount fork bottoms to fit any caliper/fork of your choice to whatever design you would like so you could have them made to look like the bottoms on the factory bikes. When I last spoke to him, he was quoting in the region of £400 per fork bottom. So for approx £1200 you could have the fork bottoms and the cheaper Brembo radial calipers. Having said that, if you already have Brembo 4 pads on there then you'll probably not notice much difference - look bl00dy good though!! Brembo race radial calipers on the other hand then yes you'll notice a HUGE difference! How deep are your pockets? :frog:

Hope this helps,

Neil

P.S. Brake lines shouldn't be any more expensive than for any other set-up.

[Edited on 30-1-2004 by neil748r]

I've been following this thread closely :o
I've just been making enquiries for a customer on the very same subject and have discovered the following.

JHP's fork bottoms are indeed for 108mm mountings, as are just about every other conversion available.
However, JHP are now doing some made by MotorCorse for the 100mm calipers.
These are £823+vat, but the calipers are a lot cheaper than the Brembo Race. circa £200 each.

The brackets that are available that convert the standard mounts to radial are, by general concensous, only any good to achieve the "look". Again, as mentioned above, they seem to have an adverse effect on the braking. Doing nothing for the stiffness of the assembly and in some cases creating vibration.
That is the opinion of suppliers etc. I have talked to. Couldn't comment personally ;)

Still expensive, but have to agree with Neil.......thay don't half look good :devil:

I have Ohlins RT forks, so could go radial bottoms and calipers, but to be honest I want to recreate the WSB look from 1995/6, when they used bilet GP calipers... My bike is an SP3 and the radials would look out of place.....

Yup those wheels were wasted on the multistrada, but they are damn fine - really nice looking, and they were a bargain!

Oh, and Im going to go for a single line to each caliper setup, from a radial master cylinder.......hopefully I'll be able to stop on a penny! :)

[Edited on 30-1-2004 by Dazza]

I agree that the conversions don't have the rigididty of the original fitment. If anyone is interested in a set, Motomecca have them and will do deals.

Rgds,

Rob

Dazza, this is probably what your after. And yes, it does stop on a dime. Narrow track 290/320 mm rotors, GP calipers 23/34 titanium pistons, radial master, and Bendix carbon matrix pads. At Rockingham last year, I ran the 290 discs for the first time and they are ace. Even at a fast track like Oulton it's plenty of braking power.

There have been some really interesting posts on this topic, and I thought that I would add my own experiences with the (front) brakes on my 996SPS.

Start: standard Brembo 2 pad calipers = do the job better than most
Stage 1: swopped for better pads = even better
Stage 2: swopped lever for Brembo Radial Pump = big difference!
Stage 3: swopped for "R" type 4 pad calipers and Bendix pads = much, much better
Stage 4: JHP fork bottoms together with Brembo Race radial calipers, seperate Kevlar lines to each caliper = better than I am ever likely to be, but it won't stop me trying ;-)

And they don't look bad either (although I've changed to fully floating Brembo disks now and YES = even better again!

Here\'s the pic
 

Anybody got a pair of 4 pad brembo`s going spare then????????, ;);););)


Chris.:roll: