i want to make you paranoid!!
 

i want to make you paranoid everytime you use any credit card!

Please be aware that your details can be read by sophisticated equipment not even touching your card, when YOU use it at an ATM.

The offenders also use camera equipment to observe your pin as you enter it.

Put the two together and your card is shopping literally within minutes..without you!

So Do NOT let it out of your sight, even at a Restaurant or leading Supermarket.

Be cautious of anyone acting suspiciously with your card, ie wiping it up and down out of sight to you.

Cover up the best you can when entering your pin, as a minute camera is placed in the serving hatch to observe you enter the numbers.

This is a sophisticated crime that is causing thousands of pound worth of misery to a lot of people all over the country, let alone the inconvienience!

Im sorry for this and I dont want to really scare you, but just be aware every time, or place you use your cards.

We've recovered two of those devices from ATM's in our area in the past month:mad:

Are you talking about "lebanese loop?" This is a very expensive gizmo that reads the microwaves from the ATM when you enter your card.

Had a group in this week. Had done around £10000, yes £10000 worth of debits and withdrawals a DAY! for the past week or so.

It is scary!!

Yep!

Scary stuff-

hooray!! someones took time off from all the rolluks talked on here to see a thread that is genuinely giving you the heads up on a real life issue!! well done lane748.

if this snooping device is fitted to the banks atm machine would the customer be liable for any fraud. not that its ok if there not, was just wondering how it worked.

Do a search for "Lebanese loop". Its one of those fake card slots that retains the card. The bad man then comes along and takes it off and gets your card.

just to clarify, this is next generation to that lebanese loop.
Its a bit of kit they use that only has to be within 20metres or so of the atm to read to microwaves your card entry generates.
They do however have to use a small camera to observe your pin no entry.

It is devastating... ther wer upwards of 20 i/ps affected on just this one job!

I've just slapped half a pound of bacon on the ATM and by my crude experimentation, it takes 120 seconds of card use to get the bacon at least half done.
Does anyone know how many seconds of card use to get a cup of milk warm?
Microwave...Bah!
Is this a genuine thread about microwave expulsions from an ATM? Surely, the health risk involved would necessitate a warning for pregnant women and and small children with abnormally large foreheads.

As an aside...warning label on mouth wash reads (no mention of mouthwash or bottle):
"Keep out of sight and reach of small children"
It's the kids I tell ya, they're out to get us.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Edited on 18-4-2004 by guest1]

I think youll find anything electrical emits some sort of pollution. Look at mobile phones!!

Its a genuine thread trying to give you an early warning to be carefull at ATMs.

Obviously we would much rather talk rollox about "wheres the strangest place you awoke"...............

Mmmm....Thoughtful debate going on here!:P

In all seriousness though, it is becoming a little scary for one that tries to be careful by shredding all credit card receipts...

We did have an episode once of some nice little scallies going through the bins and looking for card receipts.

What a nice world we live in....:o

Known as EMI and RFI (Electromagnetic Interference, Radio Frequency Interference).
Cash machines are screened to try to stop this. I'm surprised a detector can pick up sufficient info from 20metres (60 feet, or over 4 car lengths away).
Maybe the detector is located where the camera is and only the processor/storage is located that distance away...


BIG difference here is that they are intended to be transmitters/receivers, and therefore have to have some form of an aerial...


Sorry, got a bit techie there ;). It is well worth knowing, so thanks for the heads-up.

Cheers,
John.

andyb,
Many thanks for you taking time out and advise us of these issues,i for one will have a good look around the atm that i use.As a matter of interest does the bank have any responsibility for checking out the atm?
I was amazed the other day i went into a local pub for a meal with my partner got some drinks and asked if they could be put on the "tab" the barman then asked for my card at first i thought he was going to take a swipe but no he wanted to put the card it self behind the counter at this point i refused and he then called the land lord who advised me this was the pub's policy and if did not like it i should leave and i did.But in the jar was at least 10 cards from other punters, i could not believe that people are that daft or careless.
Sorry for going on but this guy really anoyned me by his attitude.:mad:

Soapbox in position:-
It's a genuine thread
It's a genuine thread
It's a genuine thread.

Now I've said it 3 times, does it make it a genuine thread? Not necessarily!.

Originally posted by andyb I think youll find anything electrical emits some sort of pollution.

Put your mid-eastern manufactured 6" desk fan next to your cathode ray monitor and see the interference.
Stick a magnet to the front of your telly and see the interference, or does David Jason really look that bad.

Precisely.
But all (and I mean purchased in the EU, p'raps other countries as well) equipment must now conform to standards which limit the amount of emi into the atmosphere.

I sit on the electrical side of the engineering fence and I've got to say that based on previous experience of specifying/supervising and hands on installation of ATM machines in establishments from Sainsburys to Bank of Scotland, I have never seen a microwave warning attached to the machines.
All machines are hard wired into comms and mains. No magnetron!

It's not a case of nah nah nee nah nah. If someone genuinely believes there to be a serious concern then let us all know. But it's all in the thread title: paranoia.
BTW Brazil nuts are radioactive.

I think the whole point of the thread was not to say there is somewhere to cook your eggs for free, more a heads up on a new way that you can get fleeced when using an ATM.

( It has long been possible to "read" information displayed on a Cathode Ray Tube from a distance of more than 20m, most decent security industry equipment suppliers could provide you with the necessary equipment. )

Anyhow... back to the point

There are a number of methods in use;

The original Lebanese Loop which makes you think your card had been swallowed by the machine whilst the scammer has been shoulder surfing to get your PIN - once you leave, he recovers your card, enters your PIN & empties your account.

The next one is the skimmer - a secondary card reader which is fixed over the card slot - this reads your card as it passes into the ATM. A small camera hidden above the keypad records your pin as you enter it. This information is then used to create a "ghost card"with your account details on & in conjunction with your PIN, your account is again emptied.

There is the fake ATM! This has been used to read cards & record account details & PINS entered intowhat appears to be a genuine ATM but when you put your card in, it comes up with
" temporarily unable to dispense cash " & gives you your card back. Again this info is used to create a ghost card. ( Only used in the US so far as far as I know )