Front brake improvement
 

I'd like to improve the front brakes on my 996 (when moving from my blade to the 996 they seem really poor!). I know that the 998 calipers can be used and also upgrading the master cylinder, but i'd like to start with the cheapest options first. (i already have braided lines).

To this end what pads do people recommend/usually use? (not sure whats in mine and they appear about 60% worn anyway).

Cheers
Simon

IMHO a change of pads won't make a huge difference but a move to 4 pad calipers will.

I had a 996 and then moved to a 998, noticed a big difference in the brakes.

Ray.

Depends on what pads you already have fitted, there are some really good Brembo race pads, but they aren't recommended for road use as they aren't much cop when cold and they cost almost as much as a set of 4 pads.
Brembo do quite a few different pads the road ones being the cheapest but may be no better than what you already have.

Ferodo HH rated Sintered pads are a good road / track day pad and don't cost the earth, but a lot does depend on what you already have fitted as to how to improve on them

P4 clipers in conjunction with a radial master cylinder coversion is a great set up, did it to my 748R befoe upgrading to moto Corse radial fork bottoms and radial p4 calipers.

http://www.ducatisportingclub.com/sh...ter+cyl inder

And


http://www.ducatisportingclub.com/sh...radial+bottoms


Chris:burn:

p4 calipers is the way forward Simon.

Look on ebay, as they come up quite often.

Upgrading the master cylinder to a radial (pref Brembo Race Radial) is always the first step for me as it gives you so much more feedback through the lever so you know what the brakes are doing.

Second step is then to change the pads. This will give you better initial "bite" and more "grip" on the disks. My preference is for Carbonne Lorraine (now known as just "CL") SBK5 pads. These are supposedly "race" pads but I've never had an issue with them on the road. The SBK3+ are the "road" equivalent but they didn't feel as good to me!

If you're not satisfied with that then look at your calipers. Really there's nothing wrong with the standard P34 Goldline calipers - they'll still have you over the front!

Switching to a P4 setup will give you more stopping power and improved feedback again as they are 4-piston with 4-pads (pad-per-piston) rather than 4-piston but two pads like the P34s.

If you find you're still wanting more, then switching to a radial caliper is the way to go. You'll either need to find some replacement fork bottoms (the subject of radial mount converters is controversial!) or swap forks completely.

Over the next few issues of the Club's "Pronto" magazine, we have some articles on this very subject, with Chris's converstion using fork bottoms, and mine switching the forks out for 1098 forks.

Obviously, all that depends on both budget and mechanical ability!!

May sound like a daft question but is the sag set for the bike and is you weight within the limit of the springs. Poor front susp will affect feel. Also service the pots it makes a massive difference use pink brake grease

I'd go for P4's. I fitted some to my SPS. Excellent upgrade plus these days they come up quite cheap as they are "unfashionable"!
P4's fitted to many Italian bikes such as RSV/Mille, 749/999 etc.

I also have a Brembo RCS m/cyl but i.m.h.o the calipers added the best improvement.


Good luck,

RX

Thanks for all the helpful comments :-)

I'm going to keep my eye on eBay then for the P4 calipers (not worried about fashion I still have some flared jeans!) and also for a master cylinder. If no calipers turn up before my pads wear out i'll try some of those suggested here. When they do turn up i'll also use those suggested here with them.

Regarding the sag, its not set up correctly yet as i'm going to fit an Ohlins shock that i have quite soon, but will do it after that.

Cheers
Simon

"(not worried about fashion I still have some flared jeans!) "

Very good.

Antonye's route will give the best bang for buck. The 19mm master cylinder will give the biggest improvement as the stock 16 is a little undersized.
Pads (Bendix MF work very well) then calipers and ultimately discs....
I ran Brembo master, P4's, Brembo supersport floating discs and Bendix MF pads. They out performed the 1098 with much better feedback :)

P4 are great, also fitted on later 01-03 Prilla RSV-R models. look for the cast bridge over where the pads drop in to ensure you get the right model!

Think the banjo are at different angle? may need to change hoses.

I second Nelly on his choice of Bendix MF Pads - they are great pads with loads of feedback and not too pricey too.

Thanks, so will all Brembo 19mm master cylinders fit or do i need to look for specific part numbers?

Cheers
Simon

There are 3 19mm cylinders. the differ in ratio...how it feels and how much lever movement you get. wouldn't bother with the 16 ratio. 18 is most popular while the 20 gives very little lever travel but arguably the best feedback. It is a bit "hair trigger" though. I'd suggest 18 for most :)

Note the 19mm Brembo radials have the banjo fitting on the bottom and will require the use of an alternative brake switch setup, such as a hydraulic pressure switch. I have often used the Brembo Radials but never with the standard hose having always gone to aftermarket aeroquip hose at the same time, so i'm not sure how well the standard Hose adapts to the 19mm radials.

A few years ago a mate updated his 748RS, adding Mag wheels, Corse spec Mag arm, shock, linkage along with a few other mods and after watching him stick it on pole at Castle Combe in the Sound of Thunder quallifying its safe to say the upgrades worked. So I thought I'd ask him out of all the upgrades which did he think was the best and his answer was the P4 Calipers

Right then it will the 18 for me, thanks.


I have been told that there is an RCS type that comes with a brake switch and these are much more reliable than using a hydraulic switch, but they are much dearer. Can anyone advise on this?

Cheers
Simon

RCS has a brake light switch.

Thanks. Every heard of the pressure switches being unreliable? Just trying to see if thr RCS will be worth the extra cost.

Cheers
Simon

I've run an 18 Brembo Race Radial on my 748 for around 5 years with a pressure switch without any problems at all. Just make sure you buy a good quality one.

Thanks. Could you give me some names?

cheers
Simon

I think mine is a HEL, but even if it isn't I would buy one:
http://www.moto-racing.co.uk/cat--Mo...cessories.html

Thanks for all your replies.

Simon

Hi guys, i'm new here so go easy!! Been lurking in the background for a while but its now time to ask for advise!!

Just been reading this thread with interest as i'm currently digging around trying to find a suitable replacement master cylinder for my '01 996.

Reason for this is I was supplied a rebuild kit for my existing unit, but on stripping down is completely different and have now been told that they're not available for my bike :mad:

Even nipped down to KTM (like last year when they supplied me with new pistons and seals for my calipers after Ducati told me politely to go away!!) but to no avail....

Now i've been offered a complete radial master cylinder set up from an '09 Aprilia RSV4 for a reasonable price but would like to be 100% sure it'll fit and be compatible...:confused:

Sitting here with baited breath awaiting your answers!!!

Thanks in advance,

Roger

It'll fit ok. It's basically the same lever as the 1098. They're 18mm bore but still an improvement.

Thanks for that, i'll set the ball in motion and hopefully be back on the road for the weekend....1st outing of the year and all that!!

P4 Capilers, braided hoses and a 19 brembo master cylinder. The whole lot will cost you (off ebay) in the region of £250 - £300. When you buy the hoses make sure you speak to the companies first as they may not be the standard fittments. plus they may not take returns. I found Hel and Goodridge really helpful.

and if anything like mine, is a better set up than the EVO ones on an 848....must check my pads on 848 in case thats why...

have a set of silver brembo P4 calipers from a 749/ 999 in excellent nick for sale

they have been modified by DWR dave woods racing to work with 15mm offset rotors (as found on the Ohlins forked ducatis) on the standard showa/marzocchi forks found on the Monster 748/916/996/998 etc

this was done to allow swapping of a front wheel between bikes without the need to change rotors each time

i have a set of used but good brembo 15mm offset, 6 hole pattern 320mm rotors from a 996R to go with them

want £200 for the set of calipers and rotors
please pm me if interested

UPDATE!!! My master cylinder turned up, complete with brake light micro switch still attached!!

Fitted perfectly, just had to mount the res bracket to one of the clip on bolts.

Bled it up and took her out last weekend, all I can say is what a difference!!

No more hard lever, lots of feel and enough stopping power to lift the back wheel off the floor when pulled hard.

All in all the best £125 i've spent in a long time!!!

Nice! Well done, always good to hear a success story :D