Race Bike
 

In the interests of supporting my hypothetical costing exercise I have been trawling the internet for ducati race bikes or track bikes that could be raced. Apart from the 999RS04 on ebay!! unless you are wishing to donate :D

Looking for R's, RS's etc that have been raced, similar to the 748 that the Skidlids is selling but I'm looking for the 9** size engines.

This sounds a bit ****y and it's only a costing exercise so please bear with me.

So, if you know someone who has one can you let me know the spec and how much. Or, if you know websites where you can pick up racebikes from (packages with vans and gene's etc are of interest) please let me know as well.

Thanks for your patience.

TP

Simply buy Weeksy's!!!!

how much are you willing to part with????

:)

I've seen Weeksy's price and know the spec so it's included in the exercise. But there is merit in Weeksy's arguments and being very slow I would need every advantage I could get = bhp.

I'm not ready to buy yet and Weeksy wants to sell now anyway ...

But hang on Tim, I was cruising through some old posts and saw a thread that you started about getting a track bike and were potentially interested in the very same things I've listed above - what did you end up doing?

Thats an interesting question. I guess part of the exercise is to see what I can get for the money etc to see how much I would want to spend (sounds painful I know).

I guess it depends on the package (if a van is included with spares, WOW, gene, tyre warmers etc ...) but I wouldn't rule out £7k.

But if there was a package that was £10k that included an extra bike or was a just a bit different then I would look at it (being an enterprising sort of bloke when the sentiment takes me - I could sell one of the bikes or bits in order to make the deal work for me\fit my budget) - you get the idea.

Like I said above, please bear with me while I go through this exercise ... I need some hard numbers to have a realistic look at this otherwise the wife wil laugh me all the way to the doors at Tiffanies and spend all the money ....

Why don't you race yours?

Well that is an option. With the work Neil's done to it's supposed to make around 120bhp at the rear (give or take a couple) plus it has the lightened flywheel ...

But ... I would have thought that would have been the more expensive way to do things. I need a bike for commuting so I will need another bike anyway. I had considered turning mine into a race bike and buying a Multi for the road.

But then I would have to spend a fair bit of cash on mine I think. Slipper clutch (£500?); race bodywork, incl tank etc (£500?); spare wheels for WOW's and tyres (£500?), rearsets (£250?) plus whatever else you guys tell me I've missed. If mine is worth say £5500-£6000 then after I race it it's worth nowhere near as much and I've thrown a lot more money at it. If I was to buy a race bike that had all the trimmings (or as much as possible) then to my mind the purchase price of the bike is cheaper, you have the potential to get a lot more for your cash than I do currently with maybe picking up an RS or something that has already been raced and therefore not worth it's non-raced value (if you know what I mean). I hope you're following me here ...

Taking it through to it's logical conclusion ..

I could spend another say £2k on my bike getting it ready and buying spare wheels, gene, tyre warmers etc and then at the end of the racing the whole lot is worth drastically less, considering the road bike is worth roughly £5750 now.

Effectively I would have spent nearly £8k on the race package (realistically it would most likely go over) and still need to buy another bike ...

Or, if I keep mine and buy a race package what could I get for £8K? would it be a better bike than a MY 2000 996? I would have thought so. Therefore being worth more at the end of the racing (assuming it was purchased after already being raced) Or I could spend less depending on whats around etc ... for a 99* based race bike.

And this leaves my road bike alone and leaves it's value where it is. Does that make sense?

So, do you think I'm full of sh*te or what? :D

most definitely, what about sharing a race bike with someone?????

Thanks Dickie, bast&rd!

I've never thought of sharing a race bike but I bought a house with my brother once and that cost me dearly ...

Wouldn't you be wanting to race in the same classes? Hrmm ...

Individual setups of the bikes ... I can see lots of reasons why this wouldn't work, maybe I'm being a bit negative. Anyone have any experience of this? I could see how a TD bike would work but not really a racebike ..

You offering?

[Edited on 20-7-2004 by tp-996]

Costings

Bike like mine £2800 (could remove and sell 748SP engine)
955 Ex GSE engine, P8 ECU Harness 54mm twin injectors, airbox and 54mm Corse Exhaust £4000
Slipper clutch £500
Rearsets £150
Spare wheels and discs £300 for 3 spokes
Tyre Warmers and Geni £350

Then there is always

The Mag arm, Mag wheels, different offset yokes, Ohlins forks, Radial 4-pads etc, etc.

At the end of the season there are usually a few well sorted race bikes for sale, although some may need a engine refreash

CSC sold one of there 996RS's last winter for £12k, Les Liney has put one of his 996SPS's up for sale before at £8k ish

dont really know how it all works but arnt there a couple of races per meeting so 2 people could race at the same meeting? cuts costs, transport, set up time/cost. ok by missing races you're not going to be challenging for any titles but thats not the point i guess. always fancied having a go just for the fun of it.

999s.......13k/2 = 6.5 k plus racig cost for the year 3.5 k each? money back on bike at the end..............hmmmmm.......

team DSC..................

Not keen on bike sharing, only one could do the SoT race, although feasable at a 2 day meeting for one rider to have 2 races on one day and 4 on the other and vice versa, with this sort of entry fee running at around £250 each what happens if the bike gets wrecked in the saturdays first race or worse practice. with all the extra added costs of getting to a race meeting I'm sure one of the participants in a shared scheme would not be happy

TP
I did look at getting a dedicated track bike previously and its a long story with many phases, but to summarise;

- I had a big road accident and decided that the road wasn't a safe place for my "committed riding", so really only do track days (with very limited road use).
- I converted a SPS for the track (fairings, slipper, brakes, flywheel, wheels etc), but crashed it expensively!!! - repaired and eventually sold her, but she was a lovely bike and had real character.
- decided to look at a ex-race bike or older Duke that represented a cheaper option for track days.
- eventually bought a ex-race R6, but didn't get on with it at all (no torque, had to strangle it to get any performance) - sold this on
- tried a few older (cheaper) Dukes, 748, 916 etc, but they realistically lacked the power that I was looking for and used to.
- bought a 996R (as I'd always wanted one) and turned this into a track bike!!! So I'd kinda gone against the "cheaper" option, but did
- I won't race this though for a number of reasons; - its too precious to crash, I'm not fast enough, I can't afford the time etc....

In reality I'm now starting to push a bit harder on the track and I'm a bit concerned about punting a circa £15K bike into the armco!

So what I'll probably do is put the R back to standard this winter and either sell it next year or stick it in the front room (proabably keep it for occasional road use)! Then I'd look for an old Gixxer thou' or similar - these have loads of power and are relatively cheap these days. You can get a lot of bike for £4K-£5K.

So I reckon it depends upon what you're looking to do - you could modify the S or get an 748RS or similar?

Tim:frog:

TP, why don't you do the minimum to your current bike to get it past scruteneering and enter the Donny round in October. See how you like it. Then, make these decisions for next year.

You'll be able to get your bike ready for very little money and it won't devalue the bike because of the one race meet. I really wouldn't worry about the amount of power for the 750/twins race, at least not in the first few races.

If you're then ready to commit yourself (and considerable funds) to racing, ponder these decisions over the winter and maybe pick up an end-of-season bike for reasonable money. Just remember, racing a Ducati is very expensive. Look at Weeksy's dilema. An RS will be mega expensive! Racing a Japanese bike will always be more economical.

Again, why not get your feet wet and see how you get on.

Tim - you're worried about binning your beautiful 996R, yet you were offering me a go at Donny the other day......me, the first WeeJohnyB, on someone else's Ducati 996R, at Donington,with my reputation:lol: (too serious to contemplate)

I change my mind on this subject from day to day, buy big and expensive it's your only chance of getting up the grid or buy cheap as chips and enjoy yourself just as much.

Tim - you are fast enough to race EASY mate, plus racing itself will knock a couple of seconds off your times.

As regards your 996R - it would be competitive, although not had the money spent that the really serious and/or rich and/or sponsored guys have, but then is not a stock bike like some guys ride and get up to mid field.

If you can't afford to completely write off the total value of it in one big race accident, then don't race it. I've seen loads of crashed bikes after races that are worthless apart from the odd part, so you really must be prepared to put it in the skip. If you're thinking for one milisecond that you don't want to bin it, then you're already 5 seconds off the pace - racing is taking risks up to the very limit of your ability and then beyond it and then into a completely unknown area you never knew existed, (and then someone else still goes past you). I know this as I race my CB5 to the limit and beyond I think, but on Monty's TZ250, it's an entirely different story and despite the fact that I still cannot get to grips with riding such a race focussed stroker, the fact that it's not mine makes a massive difference regardless of what Monty says to me about not caring if it goes down.

TP - if you want to try racing to see if you like it, I wouldn't try and convert my expensive road bike only to write it off in my first race, or go to all that trouble and not like it (plenty try and hate it). Pick up something race ready and cheap, enter a race, do a few rounds and decide what you want to do for next season, then you've got all winter to sort it out.

If you're really keen to try racing, here's an offer - get your licence and enter a New Era CB500 club round and you can borrow my CB5 for the day, (break it you buy it rule applies).

Same goes for you Tim - why not get your licence and then come to Donny or Brands Indy with me and Monty - I only do the one CB5 race for a laugh as I'm concentrating on the TZ, so you could do the other race to get a feel for the utter madness that is club racing. This is a genuine offer if you fancy it mate(s).

WeeJohnyB

[Edited on 20-7-2004 by WeeJohnyB]

WJB - I offered you a ride because you'd just binned the S4R - That's why I knew you'd look after her!

Thanks for the offer and I might just take you up on that offer of a ride on the CB500 - but I heard that the brakes were faulty!!!;);););););)

Tim:frog:

Thanks for the feedback, I like the fact that this thread has generated this level of interest. We are a sporting club after all so helping a member sort this process out is something thats good for the club and maybe for other members who are considering the same thing but haven't posted on the subject.

I've had a 20 minute conversation with Neil Spalding from Sigma this morning (who incidentally might pop his head around while we're at Donny) and he presented quite a good argument for converting my bike. Mainly based around it being well-prepped for it already (his grunter spec was designed when someone brought a 996 to him and wanted to go club racing - hence the even lower down the range high torque and power numbers) and being a known quantity. I would hate to buy a race Ducati and then face the daunting cost of a top end rebuild :o

The additional benefits from my point of view there would be that I get a bike at the end of it (I wouldn't sell it uness my circumstances dictated it) that had all manner of trick bits on it and it generally being a well sorted bike. Assuming I don't chuck it in a skip completely.

Having said that ... a few of you have said some things worthy of consideration. Felix has the best plan for cheaply getting into the race (Donny Oct 3) but contrasting that against WJB's stark reality of potentially throwing my road bike away in my first race meet just so I can get a taster - very expensive (Can you get insurance for this? It would be expensive if it existed I know - I would only do it if I was going to use my bike for the Donny taste test).

Thanks very much for your generous offer WJB - I think I will go ahead and get my ACU license but how much is the CB worth if I write it off?

I have read a bunch of blogs kicking around about people racing on the cheap - TZR's TZ's etc and other manner of Japanese machinery and I agree that it would be cheaper and still fun. But I really wanted to ride a Ducati - because I love them and I would like everything I learn on the track to be applicable to the other bikes I own (or intend to own eventually). I haven't ruled out that option but it's not what I want to do and I would only go down that road I think if I couldn't justify the money (or didn't have the money) to race a Ducati.

Neil also mentioned a 748 that he had just begging for an 853 kit and a flogging .... hrmmm ... possibly cheaper.

I don't want to look like a ponderous fool but please remember what stage I'm in at looking at this - embryonic so I'm bound to ask stupid q's and dither around - I have been accused of analysis paralysis before. I blame my job.

So far the best option (and wife friendly option) appears to be to race the CB in New Era and get a taster.


Lots of thinking to do - thanks everyone for all your help. Please if you know of websites where I can buy racebikes etc post them as well - it's all part of learning about what will and won't work. I had considered buying a written off beasty as well and turning that into a race bike. Thoughts?

No ducati is going to be cheap to run as a race bike I suppose.

If it was me I would buy a damaged bike like the one I posted about a few says ago 998s for about 6k. having said that undamaged bikes are not a million miles way from that price.

I would go for the most powerful std engine I could afford and spend the cash on entry fees/ running costs. using a standard engine should keep the costs down. When I genuinely thought I needed some more power you would already be part way up the horse power tree by going for a testastretta lump in the first place.

Again a 998s should have 136hp before you start throwing money at it.

The cheapest way to get on the track NOW is to prep your road bike up. How likely is it that you will have a ball of scrap to take home after the race?? I know you have to be prepared for the worst but are there really gonna be a grid full of unhinged nutters in the old superbike class @ derby Phoenix meet, its not a CB500 race ya know!!!!

There are 1,000,001 things to factor in about the 3rd october. How well do ya know Donny? do you have a plan about transport if the worst comes to worst?

Ray

tp-996 you Could see Jim at Bike Enders about a damaged repairable, currently he has a fire damaged Cat C 916 on Ebay,
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=24851023 18

or in a few days he may be able to offer a choice betwen a damaged repairable 996S or a 999 (model type unknown to him 5 minutes ago)

I'm not going to try and go all 'I know better than you' here as it's all opinion and I've only been doing this racing lark for 5 mins, no malice intended whatsoever, but for what it's worth.....

Go along to a few race meetings and stand at the pit lane entry, ie where the truck comes in with the bikes in bits in the back, spot how many there are for MOST races, follow the van back to the paddock and look at the state of the bikes and then look at the faces of their riders/sponsors. Motorcycle racing is dangerous, loads of people crash every single weekend. I've yet to crash through my own rider error, unless you call not checking that an certain S4R had crappy Michelin tyres, or trusting poor quality second hand tyres, or having the wrong tyre pressures, hitting oil at circuit, or being knocked off by other riders. Point is, you cannot plan it.

Last weekend 7 riders went down in my race as some clown had 'wetter water' or whatever it's called in their radiator and it leaked and it's slippy and that was that. Even the best riders in the world on the best tyres and best suspension on the best grippy GP circuit go down....check this out from Sunday's MotoGP and imagine it's your first race on your shiney road bike with the sump lockwired and there you are the front bike and you think, 'woops going a bit wide here' or you're the guy behind and you think, 'it's my first race I'll just stay out of the way and follow some of the faster guys around'

http://images.motograndprix.com/flas...812.swf&vers=3

I wouldn't buy a damaged bike...what's wrong with it, do you really know, do you want to go flat out on it? It looks ok, but is the frame really straight, is the subframe ok, are there any stress points that are going to break as you pull the brake harder than you've ever done before, what are the forks like, yolks, is the shock bent blah bla......huge trust, potentially a huge amount of time to fix it and a potential money pit.

Or, buy a current race bike for £1500- £2000....there are loads of them for sale in MCN, Bemsee, New Era, Loot, Visordown and even here on DSC. You bin it, you throw it away, fix it or sell it. You keep it upright, you keep racing it cause it's fun, or you sell it for the same money you paid for it the following week., I've never been in one, but I've watched loads and they don't tend to deliberately elbow and push each other off the track like some of the CB5 guys are prepared to do...been there, done that, got the injuries, got the trophies.

In any case, would most road only riders buy a shiney Ducati with a lockwire all over it, or are you going to replace all the bits before you sell it again as a road bike.

Sound of Thunder is not a CB500 race for sure, but I've seen a lot of bent Ducatis in the paddock!

Weigh this up- carefully! But be aware that racing is as far away from track days as sledging is to doing the cresta run.

Whatever you decide, just do it

WeeJohnyB (crash hat at the ready)

Not really wanting to argues this further, but in the end you'll need to decide if you want to give it a try. Period.

You can justify the decision either way in a million different ways, many of them have been written about above. Truth is, if you try to make a logical decision, it'll be against racing. Afterall, racing is completely illogical! So, TP, don't try it! :lol:

No Ducati race bike would be cheap - I agree, especially in relation to what you can spend on smaller capacity Japanese stuff. I guess its relative. Racing a stock motor would be cheaper than an RS (in maintenance and initial purchase). A damaged repairable is definitely an option. I don't have the money to spend yet or even know whether I would want to go on with it - as WJB says, although I'm pretty certain that I would. I agree with Ray that a testastretta engined beasty would be a very good place to start giving me a HP boost and an easier platform to work from later if more bhp is required (obviously post suspension etc, whatever)

I don't even know how quick I'm going to be, I already know I'm nearly never the fastest bloke on a rideout but thats initially not my concern. If I find that I like racing and want to continue then I'll want to address that - but that was something I was doing anyway with two CSS days currently booked.

Thanks to all for your posts, as I said at the start this was a fact finding mission for an idea that is in an embryonic stage - I just wanted to leverage the benefits of all of your experience out there as many of you have been there done that as far as this is concerned. I may not end up going ahead with it at all but I would never know without having done the exercise.

Logic is for deciding how I'm going to race not necessarily IF I want to. I want to do it - it's as simple as that. It's a matter of finding out which way I'm going to do it that will be the most palatable that is the case. Untimately this would need to be a mutual decision with my wife and I and she's not convinced it's such a good idea yet - if I don't get her buy-in it doesn't get off the ground. We'll see what happens.

At this stage the best thing for me to do is to get my ACU license (started that ball rolling today by filling out my application for a UK license - changeover my Aus one) and to sample the racing taste test on WJB's CB :o

Then, if the wife is cool (hrmmm, don't know) and I want to go ahead (more than likely) it will be case of deciding from the following options:

1. Racing cheaper Japanese kit
2. Racing a Ducati which involves making a decision on:
2a. Racing my bike and buying something to commute on
2b. Buying a race bike with the kit etc
2c. Buying a damaged repairable and building it up (again depends on the write off circumstances)

Now I need to convince the wife that buying another seat of leathers is a good idea seeing as I only have zip togethers and not a one piece ...


:devil: :devil:

A bit of a contradiction there, There are a huge amount of racebikes out there that have been crashed, and are quite often back out there racing the following weekend, sometimes the following day or even the following race.

I've seen a Ducati have a big highside on a Friday practice day be patched up over night pass scrutineering in the morning and then spend the next 2 days racing (dispite the broken ribs and the bones in Dallas's feet) That same bike was later crashed at Donington, Keevil and Mallory and still its perfectly fine for racing.

But if you go racing expect to crash at some point as WJB says it may not be of your own making but it happens, jujst over a week ago at Thruxton several races were canceled as they ran out of time due to the accidents, the biggest hold up was the guys in the Streetstock race, 8 riders crashed at the complex on one lap, racing was halted for a while as the circuit ran out of ambulances

make your choice wisely, read Weeksy's account of his first ever race a few years back on his Fireblade, its a bit different from his latest reports.

Yep, I'm aware of the physical risks of racing - if you decide to race then thats the way it is. I'm not kidding myself on this one.

I know I'll end up going down the road at some point, but I'd rather it be at a track than under a car\truck. More likely to have runoff etc (I know not all tracks do and some have armco etc in stupid places but it's still safer than slipping off a road edge into some trees or oncoming traffic.

Yep, I can see why! :lol:

I've done some searching for that BTW - I can't find it.

Can someone help me out?

Hey Felix, I haven't gotten to analysis paralysis yet - haven't gotten all the facts yet - nearly though. But I'm already developing a decision flow chart in my head ...

[Edited on 20-7-2004 by tp-996]

Mate, don't hang on to it for me - I may not even go racing if the wife is not keen. Even if she is I may decide to buy a TZ or something and go racing on the 'cheap' (I guess it's a relative term when it concerns racing!)

I just checked your auction and you've still got three days to go - it could be gone!

Might get a gixxer 750 :o :lol:

TZ and CHEAP. Now there's two words I've never seen used together before.
Rings - 200 miles
Piston and small end 400 miles
Crank rebuild - 800 miles
Plus all the gaskets and seals that go with each strip.
Crash damage is usually easy to fix though as there isn't as much to damage and not much weight bouncing about.
Also they take a bit of getting used to, but once you get the hang of it there is nothing like a true race bike.:sing:

Good point. I guess it's relative to racing an RS or 99* engined beasty no?

there are some very good points made by Skidlids..
this season is my first season racing,last year i done about ten trackday and never had one off...and i would say i was riding at 100%..

but you soon find out in your first race you were never riding at 100%......
plus if you go racing you will come off even those it might not be your fault,
so far this season i've had two broken arms :( after the first one i should of gave myself longer to recover, but you just want to get back out there..
so i gave it six week then on the 31st of may i went back to mallory,in my first race i got 9th in the allcomer which would put me in the a-final.
then in my second race in the F600 i got a good start and was running to the top 10 and i could see the leaders then it all went wrong, i thought i could overtake one of them at gerrard i was nearly flat out in 5th gear when i had a big highside and broke my arm again..
and like skidlids said about the bike..
the damage to my bike was
forks
front wheel
rear wheel
frame - swingarm bend
bodywork
exhaust

I had to replace all of these,but i'm luckier i have two great team m8s who have rebuild the bike for me...when i went to croft to help them out they, said had alook in the garage and there was my baby again..

Agree with you 100% Kev, I know from experience as you are well aware. Race bikes go down a lot and my CB500 and Monty's TZ250 are no exceptions, we've spent hours until last light and back up first light begging, borrowing and making bits to repair bikes in order to get someone out for the next race, but they TEND to be fixed to a decent standard as they are going to be raced again and racers know the bike has to be right as it's going far closer to it's limit than any Sunday morning blast on the road and aside from the danger factor, you are not going to go very quickly on a bike with bent subframe, swing arm, yolks, forks, frame etc.

My view is based on helping someone (TP) come into racing for the first time and I personally don't think I would buy a crashed 996 road bike and spend time and money fixing it and then turning it into a race bike when I could buy something already completely prepared, even if it has been crashed. For example, I'd rather buy my crashed/repaired CB500 than a crashed CB500 road bike out of MCN.....just my opinion.

Oh and TZ....cheap......never heard that in the same sentence before unless it's "does anyone have any cheap bits for a TZ we can borrow" to which the answer is "you poor sweet innocent child you....get your cheque book out".

The trouble with this racing lark is we always want more - the bikes underpowered, doesn't handle well, I need the latest gismo titanium addition thingy like the other boys at school - it's a money pit if you let it be that way. Single model series are the way to go if you want to try it, like the CB's, Hornets or SV's - in theory everyones on the same bike and it's down to rider skill. Of course rider skill counts the most in the big expensive classes as well, but so does throwing £000's at it - take the 600 series, I've just bought and ex race CBR6 with a lot of trick bits on it but it's only 105bhp - there are talented guys doing mid/upper field on near stock bikes, but the boys at the front have talent and another 30bhp and full Ohlins forks etc - now if I had the money, maybe my opinion would be completely different eh:(:D;)

WeeJohnyB

[Edited on 21-7-2004 by WeeJohnyB]

My current R6 race bike, 916Bip road bike (raced at Thruxton the other week and trackdayed at Cadwell) my old TL1000S used for road and race, last years TT bike another R6, my Fireblade that I raced and this years TT spare ZXR400 all came from breakers. And all have been simple to sort out/rebuild. Its best to try and pick up a CAT D or C still with the V5.
If a crashed bike comes from a breakers with Bent forks it is reflected in the price which should also allow for the other damaged parts.
With 916 USD Show forks going for £150 its not worth trying to sort out bent ones and the same applies to wheels etc.

Also I have seen a few bodged together race bikes tarted up with new fibreglass to help them see. Brake banjo bolts used as calliper mounting bolts on a R1, luckily noticed before its new owner took it anywhere near a track. I would rather see any damage for myself and then decide to buy it or not than buy Mutton dressed as Lamb

And WJB you're right TZ and Cheap is a strange concept

I stand well and truly corrected on the TZ price issue!

I had assumed that they would be cheaper to run than something like an 99*RS or even standard 99* I should know better really, I remember the spray I got from my platoon Sargeant about making assumptions once - still makes me shiver.

Thanks guys.

Now then, a TZR is cheap (as in the parallel twin Bemsee Yamaha Past Masters class), a TZ is anything but! The TZ is a high maintenance pukka race-bike.

I've little to add to WJB's wise words but, TP, if you fancy something similar to the Duc, in the same race-class as the Duc (rather than a £1.5-2k racebike in a different class) then try a Mille. I've a pal who's just put up his Bemsee-podium-winning (with him on it) Mille for around £3k. Milles make a lot of sense as race and trackday bikes, and there are plenty around (pre-prepared) because of the MRO Mille-challenge class.

Andy



Andy

I may decide to buy a TZ or something and go racing on the 'cheap' :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

You poor innoccent child-I shall be able to bore you silly all weekend about racing a "cheap" TZ250-but it has to be said that once sampled forever smitten. There is absolutely NOTHING like a GP250 when it's going right, just writing about the 'wee beastie' as Johnny B calls her is making me twitchy. After a TZ250 everything else is just a street bike-including Duke's.
I bought mine as a trackday bike on the basis that I paid £2000 for her and it would cost me that to fix a lowside on the ST4S-no cheap track fairings available for them see.
Yes you do have to keep on top of the maintenance, mines a 'V' twin on which the maintenance schedule isn't quite so aggressive as posted by Steve M.
Pistons and rings 300 miles-but they will last a lot longer £125 the pair
Small end 600 miles £20
Crank 1000-1500 miles, but again some people run them much longer-like 4000 miles! £300-£350
Fuel-hmmmm 18mpg at £7-£8 gallon (avgas and race oil)

I fully rebuilt mine before the season start, we are now more than half way through and she has done 300 miles including practice days and 100 miles on a track day so it's not too bad. Don't forget tyres, they can cost a heap especially running slicks, you need 3 sets of wheels so you can have slicks, inters, and wets all mounted, otherwise you spend all weekend running back and forth to the tyre man and mistakes get made in the rush-don't they John boy??
If you want an idea of running a 748RS Neil Spalding has a maintenance chart up on his site of the schedule-it frightened me-especially considering Ducati Corse part prices.

If this lot doesn't put you off take WJB up on his offer and ride the CB500-it's an absolute hoot to ride and the class is VERY competitive. Don't worry about crashing it-it's only worth about £20!:lol: Sorry WJB, couldn't resist.

John

[Edited on 21-7-2004 by Monty]

jim at Bike enders Now has the 996S (£4000) and 999BP (£5950) for sale on Ebay, Either would make a ideal track tool, if you didn't want to ride it on the road you could sell off a few of the bits to put towards race bodywork etc.

Ok, so let me get this straight then because I'm a little confused. TZ's aren't cheap to race then? Ok ok, I get it!

Thanks for the tips skidlids - I like the idea of those two bikes. Hopefull something like that will be around when the time comes.

Hehe. There's a chap down the road from you, TP, who's retired now but got as far as being Bemsee GP250 champion in a long and illustrious amateur racing career. His year 2000 TZ250 cost £20k new, it ran on Elf racing fuel at £7 per litre, requiring a fairly skilled mechanic at every race-meeting (and in between) to keep it on song. He races a Caterham these days and it's probably a lot cheaper!

Andy

Right - I'll definitely be wanting a cheaper form of racing than that.!

Maybe pushbikes .... :lol:

Do they still race MZ's :lol: (and they really did - ETZ250's)

[Edited on 21-7-2004 by STEVE M]