Ducati Sporting Club UK > DesmoDue Race Series > DesmoDue - General Questions and Chat > Desmo Due racing 2005

[skidlids]

Originally posted by ChrisBushell
I suggest that twin discs should be allowed, even if not originally fitted; with an appropriate master cylinder.

Does that satisfy people?

Chris

Yes and No, what happens to owners of Single Disc ONLY (no lugs on other leg) 600SS's, upgrading forks, buying a 2nd disc and calliper, hoses and Mastercylinder isn't a cheap upgrade, if it was me (No I haven't got one) I would rather go SPS disc and 4 pad calliper and see how I got on, maybe a bit lees braking than a twind disc but also less rotating mass.

[Nattyboy]

Originally posted by louigi
Natty just rang me and suggested a good idea.
I build a 600 monster racer during the closed season, enter it for the challenge, so that folk who cant afford to buy a bike and race for a whole season, or leading the championship and binned their ride. Can hire it per meeting, this will enable celeberty riders like "wiggly" weeksy or "footpeg" Felix, to have a go?
They did a similar thing with the S4 challenge when there was always a spare place on the grid and obscure riders were plucked from the high street and chucked in at the back of the grid, funnily it was usually them that won!
If I get some positive feedback I will purchase a bike and start the process. I got some bits to build a well trick little Monster.
spanners are out!

Rattler...forget what I said yesterday when we met..looks like a might bag a go after all..

Nat

[skidlids]

Taken from Desmo Due Q&A thread as this is the discussion thread

Originally posted by dickieducati
the rules are already set and as far as i can see they are reasonable. they will always be someone that feels they could be changed to suit them better/make it fairer/cheaper etc. tough titties. that’s life. Happens all the time.

I totally agree, the terms making it INCLUSIVE and not EXCLUSIVE sum it up well.

I have the predicament of do I sell one of my current race bikes that I could if I wanted race on 30 weekends a year doing anything up to 6 races a day, in favour of a Desmo Due and do 8 races on it.

Hence my interest in a spec for the Desmo Due that would make it worth entering in a Mini Twins class with a club like North Glos that would offer me a further 12 race days a year with again 2 races a day.

Which is why I'm still WAITING to see which direction things are going before I make a decision one way or another

[rockhopper]

Here's a thought guys.

Instead of allowing all sorts of expensive mods to give the 600 the same power as the 620, why not restrict the 620 so it produces the same power as the 600? Run like this for a few years till all the 600's die a natural death then remove or gradully reduce the restriction. A simple plate with a hole in the intake would do the job. Cost buttons as well.

[pguenet]

It is all quite interesting all that, I was actually suggesting something along those lines to Dave the other day as there is a Ducati cup in France (based on the 900SSie).

First feedback about interest for the idea. Yes I would be interested in principle as I would like to take it a step further than trackdays, yet would not want to go racing with the big boys quite yet.
No I will not make a decision before the end of the month mainly because of persoal reasons that I have many other worries on my mind at the moment. But also because this is not such an easy choice to make for me, I have already a 916 for the track, a 996 for the road and a Honda for everyday. I am not sure that I would actually sell the 916 for a SS600 even if this is to go racing. I still want to have a decent bike to do trackdays as well. Buying yet another bike is turning into madness (especially as I am also thinking of a dirt bike, etc.). I agree that this is a nice problem to have but it is a problem nevertheless for me to take up the series. I don't know if many other members are in this situation but I would feel totally undecided before making the commitment:
- Do I get a decent track bike to be enjoyed all year round on trackdays?
- Do I take up the series on a 600cc and feel frustrated on trackdays?
- Do I run 2 bikes?
- Are SS600 and M600 the right answer for the series? The worry about going cheap might not necessarily stand if the category of people that are potentially interested have to run an extra bike after all?

Second feedback
- If 600cc it is I think that the serie should allow only plain standard 600cc. You may allow 620ie when the second hand prices would be lower with the option of boring out older machines. You may start that transition in a couple of years or so.
- Just very basic mods like removing road gears, lights, allowing fiber fairing, etc
- Brakes - allow stainless hoses and whatever choice of pads. Discs will need changing as well and EBC, etc might offer cheaper options. I think that you should put restriction on calipers and master cyl but allow some lattitude on disc(s) and pads as those would require changing often. You should allow single or twin discs set ups.
- Tyres - I would go for single supplier or a small range of similar types tyres from 3 or 4 suppliers. It should be a standard road compound like Diablos (but not Corsas) and no wets allowed. Allowing a range of tyres would see most people turning up with new compound every race.

Suggestions
In light of my initial comment of some people likely to want to retain only one (decent) track bike, is there any scope for spinning off a second series like:
- open serie for any Duke?
- open serie for any road bike? (although many road bikes in the club have serious mods, so road bike does not mean much anymore)
- special serie for 748 4 valves / 900 2 valves with some restrictions on how standards bikes should be.

Cheers
philippe

[Monty]

"Suggestions
In light of my initial comment of some people likely to want to retain only one (decent) track bike, is there any scope for spinning off a second series like:
- open serie for any Duke?
- open serie for any road bike? (although many road bikes in the club have serious mods, so road bike does not mean much anymore)
- special serie for 748 4 valves / 900 2 valves with some restrictions on how standards bikes should be."

Thanks for all the thoughts guys, to give you an idea of where we were coming from the initial series suggestions were:

750 cup based on 750SS/Monster-my opinion was that this would be a difficult one since there aren't actually that many 750's out there.
My suggestion was to go to 900SS/monster simply because of availability-when this was fully kicked around it was finally decided to come up with the 600/620 series as it was felt that 900's would possibly be too fast for novices whereas the 600's are both available and slower/less intimidating, and cheaper!
I did suggest a 748 series but again this was felt to be too expensive as there are so many things you can do to a 4 valve motor and 'cheque book' racing would seem to be the inevitable consequence.
Having decided on 600/620's there was a lot of discussion around whether we just restricted it to standard spec 600's-possibly just monsters-with modifications limited to making them race worthy. It was then decided that since the 600 with a 680 kit would produce roughly the same peak power as a 620 but would actually cost less that we should allow 620's.
That's how we got to where we are, and from the post's so far most people are happy with things as they are structured. If you go out and buy a 620ie monster for about £3,000 you can with minimal mods race it. As an alternative you can pick up a 600SS/Monster for £1,500 or less and race that, to be competitive with the 620 you will need to spend a bit to get it to 680 but it will still be cheaper than the 620, and it will be worth less-either way it's (comparatively) cheap racing. To have an absolutely level playing field would mean us agreeing that either we use all 600's-probably monsters since they are more available, or all 620's again monsters, which would sort of go against what we are trying to do.
I'm not saying that we have got it right, but it's about the best we can do.

John

[ChrisBushell]

Boys,

Whilst I think that the level of discussion that this idea has produced is excellent, we can debate things till the end of the year and then end up with no racing!

No we cant get it right first time or suit everybody, what we have to do is try and accomodate as many people as we can (inclusive not exclusive).

I hope that I can get agreement in principal on two sections within the racing at the end of next week (583s & 620 + 674). If that is so will it satisfy those that are interested and close that item out?

Tyres I beleive we are close to an agreement on, my understanding being that you will be able to choose tyres from a variety of suppliers but that the size and type will be defined.

We have suggested 4 rounds eight races, merely as a means of keeping costs down in the first year. If the entrants are willing to commit financially to more rounds then they can have them I beleive.

Brakes, dont see an easy answer here but am inclined to allow the twin option, but that we tighten up on the calipers that are allowed.

Does that satisfy those that wish to enter?

Chris

[Chris Wood]

All,

Having read all threads with interest here I go;

This is a great idea and IMO suits members who, maybe like me;
- like riding on trackdays!
- always wondered about racing?
- limited ££££
- own a road bike, but don't want to ruin on track - Senna 1
- or bought an ex race bike, but don't want to race it - WSS 748RS

So I'm in and agree with the keep it simple philosophy. I'm no techy and just want to race a standard bike.

I someone wants to spend £££££ to win races then good for them!, everyone will see what enabled them to win - ££££ vs talent. Congrats to carbon fibre/overbore/stickytyre guy for winning the series! (Boring)

I want to spend very little and then race......if I come 4th or 44th I don't care, I will be living out my MotoGP fantasy and having fun!

We will all know who is riding what, so the 600/620 debate is irrelavent, let's include them all and have some fun racing.

I'm sure we have all been on track days and gone past or been passed by people on more/less expensive bikes, a one make series will reduce the £££ element but never eliminate it.

So turn the hard to the stop and have fun!

Oh and a question,

Can we enter as a 'Team' with two riders taking turns for rounds?

Phew.....

Chris.

[ChrisBushell]

Chris,

Glad to hear your words of praise and gald that you are in!

I cannot give a catagoric yes to your team idea, but I think that you can assume that would be ok afterall it is the bike that we enter on the grid "with a rider attached".

Maybe for the 2nd year we might consider a longer race with rider changes, but I am not even oing to go there for 2005

Chris

[Chris Wood]

Thanks Weeksy,

As a NOVICE I hope to stay true to my quote above.

At least for the first season!

Cheers.