Ducati Sporting Club UK > DesmoDue Race Series > DesmoDue - General Questions and Chat > No Modifications - what does it mean

[faith-healer]

I make no apology for copying my posting from "the other channel"

I know we're all champing at the bit, waiting for the clocks to go forward on to race time, but ffs this is a total NON ISSUE

Blueprinting or balancing, what ever you want to call it, is NOT illegal under the rules.

If you take 100 new, identical (looking) OEM standard pistons or con rods and then weigh them there would probably be 80+ different weights for each part.

All Nogs' has done is find two pistons and 'rods that are very close, if not identical in weight....

IE. BALANCING.

Perhaps this topic has developed "legs" because so many DD'ers don't have a mechanical background and don't know or want to know what's going on under the tank. This is not a criticism



THIS IS

What a great advert for 'DD', this topic is, to any browsing newbie thinking of having a go!!!



........................They will run a mile and take up fishing

Charlie

[Lily]

Originally Posted by skidlids

lots of confusing stuff...


Crikey how much
be better off racing in CB5s

Kev

You don't actually have to do any of it you know so the expense to you is whatever you want it to be.

[Senna3]

Originally Posted by faith-healer

I make no apology for copying my posting from "the other channel"

I know we're all champing at the bit, waiting for the clocks to go forward on to race time, but ffs this is a total NON ISSUE

Blueprinting or balancing, what ever you want to call it, is NOT illegal under the rules.

If you take 100 new, identical (looking) OEM standard pistons or con rods and then weigh them there would probably be 80+ different weights for each part.

All Nogs' has done is find two pistons and 'rods that are very close, if not identical in weight....

IE. BALANCING.

Perhaps this topic has developed "legs" because so many DD'ers don't have a mechanical background and don't know or want to know what's going on under the tank. This is not a criticism



THIS IS

What a great advert for 'DD', this topic is, to any browsing newbie thinking of having a go!!!



........................They will run a mile and take up fishing

Charlie

Fishing
Have you seen the price of those rods and poles ,nets reels floats hooks spinners bait boxes and licences for the river and cannals and then sea fishing then ill need a boat how much think ill go racing its cheaper even if i BLUE PRINT MY ENGINE

CAN WE RACE YET OR ARE WE ALL OF TO THE SCRUTERNERS BAY

[nelly]

Originally Posted by skidlids

But the thread wasn't meant to be just about Nogs crank, although the thread where it was mentioned was the catalyst for the initial question "No Modifications - what does it mean"

To me and many others No modification means leave well alone, if it doesn't and relates to meeting factory specifications I'm wondering if I can afford this little lot


one of my con rods is slightly heavier than the other and both are heavier than the minimum weight quoted by the factory, I know what I will do I will balance them so that the meet the factory minimum weight. After all the engine will be smoother and less likely to shake apart

Same as above goes for the new pistons

Also my rear cylinder head has a lower flow rate than the front cylinder head and I know someone elses flows more than that, so I think I'll get someone to alter them so they both match the higher flow rate of somebody elses engine, so long as I don't exceed the class bhp limit

Just been comparing camshafts and found mine have a fraction less lift than my mates and are even different to each other, I'll have to get them ground to the factory tolerance that will give the best performance. I'm not modifyong them as thats probably how some left the factory.

After checking the combustion chambers one is marginally smaller than the other so what I will do is match the other one to it, a quick skim will sufice after all its not really removing material as thats how it should have left the factory it just good practice to balance them out.

Just found out so and sos flywheel weighs a tad less than mine but is still within factory tolerance, I'll have to adjust mine to suit.

Crikey how much
be better off racing in CB5s

Skids, I understand what you're saying. I do. Hell, it could well be happening. Who knows? There may be a vast selection of 583 parts under someones bench being selectively pieced together into finely matched component sets..... (and no i don't have any room under my bench )

I stand by previous posts though. I've turned work away because of what's been asked of me but I don't see an issue with building a good, reliable engine and if that included being asked to balance it then I would.

Just an aside though, if the RC do clarify the issue, and just suppose it was ruled against, how the hell would you check it?

[skidlids]

Originally Posted by Lily

Kev

You don't actually have to do any of it you know so the expense to you is whatever you want it to be.

I know I don't, so far I haven't even taken a head off any of my DD engines as the series is about cheap racing which s why I signed up for it as soon as it was announced having just thrown a F400 bike owing me £4k in the skip, a bike which was going to have given me cheaper racing than SoT or Powerbike

But it doesn't mean someone will not do it, if the rules permit the cheque books often come out in the hope of gaining some advantage

Me, I normally just buy a couple of engines set the valve clearances, fit new belts, dial in the cams, replace oil and filter and then get on and race.

Although this season may be different as I have just emailed the list of engine work (ok its Blueprinting) to the RC to see if I can get approval for any of them as it may prove a cheaper route to finding the 7bhp to take me up to the class limit without having to invest in a FIM ECU

[paynep]

Originally Posted by faith-healer

I make no apology for copying my posting from "the other channel"

I know we're all champing at the bit, waiting for the clocks to go forward on to race time, but ffs this is a total NON ISSUE

Blueprinting or balancing, what ever you want to call it, is NOT illegal under the rules.

If you take 100 new, identical (looking) OEM standard pistons or con rods and then weigh them there would probably be 80+ different weights for each part.

All Nogs' has done is find two pistons and 'rods that are very close, if not identical in weight....

IE. BALANCING.

Perhaps this topic has developed "legs" because so many DD'ers don't have a mechanical background and don't know or want to know what's going on under the tank. This is not a criticism



THIS IS

What a great advert for 'DD', this topic is, to any browsing newbie thinking of having a go!!!



........................They will run a mile and take up fishing

Charlie

You're new here aren't you?

This is "normal" for close season - wait until the racing starts, ACU-approved handbag is a pre-requisite for the 'board...

PS Doesn't mean I disagree with you tho'

[skidlids]

Originally Posted by nelly

Just an aside though, if the RC do clarify the issue, and just suppose it was ruled against, how the hell would you check it?

Be hard in this day and age with Human nature as it is
Honesty in racing and sticking to the rule book is diminishing each year, be it BSB or DD

[nogaromill998]

Kev, to a point I understand where you are coming from, but if you read all the threads on the other side you'd have had a clearer pic in the first place. The engine was bought and had been standing for a year plus in a wet shed and was in a right state, so it HAD to come apart. yes I COULD have just slung it in the frame, and made it work, but had I done so I would have run an 05 675cc big bore kit and have been none the wiser. Having discovered thats what the bike was fitted with I swapped the big bore kit for a set of std barrels, pistons etc and fitted them . Now who knows how the big bore kit affected the balance of the crank? I just cant see that making sure it was balanced by selecting from a number of components those giving the best balance is wrong in any way shape or form. You yourself said that you can buy engines cheaply enough, so being the owner of 4 of them I have ample parts to swap around...cost is therefore not an issue, and even if it were, its MY choice......NOTHING in the rules says there is a limit to how much I choose to spend on my bike.....and NOTHING in the rules says there is a limit to the number of spare parts I am permitted to own/use/swap between. As has already been said...what IS to be done if a crank regrind is needed ?

[nogaromill998]

Are you suggesting I am being dishonest Kev? Cheating in other words? Only needs a yes/no answer...

[nelly]

Originally Posted by skidlids

Be hard in this day and age with Human nature as it is
Honesty in racing and sticking to the rule book is diminishing each year, be it BSB or DD

It's always been there though Kev. There's more forums around today though
Never saw Mike and Ago on one chatting did ya