Ducati Sporting Club UK > General > Idle Chat > Any legal eagles out there?

[antonye]

Response from a mate who is a solictor working mainly with very large (re-insurance) contracts, and also a motorcyclist himself ... although he rides a Blackbird!

He says:

My own view is that a "no racing" clause is not the same as a track day.
Track days have instructors and are heavily supervised, not at all like
racing.

Need to read the policy document very very carefully. My old one didn't
exclude track days, but my current Carole Nash policy does. It is becoming
more and more common to exclude track days specifically.

If I had a dispute, i'd send them a letter asking them to confirming the
cover within 14 days or you will take legal action. Thing is, for me, i
know what to do and it costs nothing. For a layman, perhaps contact the
Insurance Ombudsman first and see what happens. But deffo send the
threatening "letter before action" which should at this stage refer to
liability only, and not the quantum of the claim.

[keith_mann1959]

Hi Rockhopper
Well i would expect that its because some insurers are making an explicit statement that track days are not covered.( because they know, but will not admit to you or me unless pressed that they are on dodgy ground with the " its covered by the no racing" clause).
So far we have only heard from Antoyne's friend about whats on his policy, the secondary point to this debate was to try to discover what others have specifically on the policies.
Does no one care or know what they are covered for?

[bradders]

mine is not specifically mentioned, but had the same answer. The way to test this is do a track day and crash, then let us know how you get on. I think you may win but as said earlier, it is down to test cases.

Also, I think it is part of your obligatory duty to advise anything which is not 'normal' for your ins policiy - otherwise it may be void or subject to lower claim payment. Track days are not normal - I have been riding for a fair few years and recently did my first.

In an ideal world, it would be like communting - you either include or exclude and your premium reflects this choice. That way I dont have to pay for you to be covered.

[keith_mann1959]

We have already been over this "duty" thing, Track days are NOT abnormal for a bike rider.Certainly not in law. There has been a test case and the guy won. The insurance companies are hiding behind ignorance.
You miss the point when you say you don't want to pay on your policy to cover my track days. YOU ALREADY ARE!
I may take exception to you commuting in London or riding in the rain for example. Its a daft argument

[antonye]

As Keith says, the contract is there to stipulate what can and canoot be done. The use of the word "racing" has a legal definition, which is then expanded in the contract by the use of words like "timed events" to cover things like drag racing. Also check the "pizza delivery" clause that's in there too!

A contract works both ways - unless it explicitly states in the contract not to, then you can do it. That's the way laws work.

[keith_mann1959]

Thanks Antonye, i think we are getting through.
Seems no body knows or cares what their policy covers them for though.
I had hoped someone would know who the test case winner in MCN was. as he has done the hard expensive work already. I am going to talk to MCN myself.
I hope none of us have to find out on a track day for real. But if the worst happens don't let the insurance company stop you from getting the money you are almost ceratinly entitled to.
Alternatively lob the thing from a moving Transit van on a suitable quiet country road and see if they can tell the difference.

[antonye]

Originally posted by keith_mann1959
Alternatively lob the thing from a moving Transit van on a suitable quiet country road and see if they can tell the difference.

Many a true thing said in jest...

I know of a guy that rolled his Subaru Impreza limited edition Catalunya model on a trackday at Castle Coombe. It was a right old mess - crushed the roof in and everything.

He got it towed to the road outside the circuit and called the AA...

[Rob B]

I contacted my company before I did a roadskills day at Cadwell. No problems once the people running the trackday had faxed me a paper explaing the facts of the day, instruction, not racing etc. The day did include some elements not included in a normal trackday but if when we where using the circuit, it was as fast as you could go and the instructor was there to help you hang off and go faster.

This day earn't me a furher 5% discount off the insurance too.

Might be a way forward, contact the organisers in advance and see if they have a standard doc that you can fax on to your company to explain the facts. Difficult for them to back out of a claim too.

Rgds,

Rob

[rockhopper]

I dont have fully comp on my bike so to be honest i look for the cheapest quote and go for that!

I have no idea what it actually covers me for but if it wasnt a legal requirement to have insurance then i dont think i would bother.

[keith_mann1959]

Hi Antonye
I was not joking!