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Old 06-Dec-2006, 15:31   #1
DSC Member Jools Jools is offline
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Originally Posted by ariel
Jools,
With all due respect, I believe you are burying your head in the sand. The present levels of vicious crime are unacceptable.
Take it from me (a really old git) there was a time when England was much better and more crime free than it is now.
But there's one thing for sure there's NO hope of an improvement in the future if the views expressed on this board are anything to go by.

I am also an old git (in my 50's) and I can't accept that there was a golden age when everything was better and crime free.

I can remember reading about people being robbed at knifepoint and about gangland razor fights when I was a kid. The likes of the Krays and 'Mad Frankie Frazer' were running around. When I was growing up there were regular fights going on between rival village gangs and these same people would regularly nick cars to travel to and from the latest rumble. Violence on football terraces was rife with people using bottles and coins as missiles and every ground had the end where the hard men went for a fight. In my teenage years two people were fatally stabbed (at seperate times and in seperate incidents) in the little market town where I live - both in fights after chucking out time. Gangs of skinheads made a religion out of using their Doc Martens. My dad also used to tell me stories of the street violence that went on in his day - it has always been the same, because human nature has always been the same.

What has changed is the technology available to the law enforcement agencies and the rigour with which they need to report incidents. I'm sure that rather than there being halcyon days of law and order as depicted in 'Heartbeat', the reality of the times was the local beat Bobby dealing out summary justice on the end of a truncheon with no need for tedious paperwork. Same crimes happened, just didn't get reported.

With the advent of greater levels of reporting (and being held to account for performance through the statistics thus produced) it fuels another phenomenon. There has never been more competition in the media. Hundreds of TV and local radio stations all vying with each other, millions of websites and internet based media plus the traditional newspaper press competing in a state of frenzy for their slice of a finite advertising cake. How do the proprietors and editors of these media outlets raise their profile above the clamour? By the time honoured methods of hype, exageration and downright lies, bending statistics to suit their particular editorial stance - the worst of them playing on the fears, prejudices and ignorance of the man in the street to whip up a frenzy of public opinion to suit their circulation figures or political leanings


The Patent Jools Mood Meter -Today I am:


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Old 06-Dec-2006, 15:44   #2
Tonio600 Tonio600 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jools
I am also an old git (in my 50's) and I can't accept that there was a golden age when everything was better and crime free.

I can remember reading about people being robbed at knifepoint and about gangland razor fights when I was a kid. The likes of the Krays and 'Mad Frankie Frazer' were running around. When I was growing up there were regular fights going on between rival village gangs and these same people would regularly nick cars to travel to and from the latest rumble. Violence on football terraces was rife with people using bottles and coins as missiles and every ground had the end where the hard men went for a fight. In my teenage years two people were fatally stabbed (at seperate times and in seperate incidents) in the little market town where I live - both in fights after chucking out time. Gangs of skinheads made a religion out of using their Doc Martens. My dad also used to tell me stories of the street violence that went on in his day - it has always been the same, because human nature has always been the same.

What has changed is the technology available to the law enforcement agencies and the rigour with which they need to report incidents. I'm sure that rather than there being halcyon days of law and order as depicted in 'Heartbeat', the reality of the times was the local beat Bobby dealing out summary justice on the end of a truncheon with no need for tedious paperwork. Same crimes happened, just didn't get reported.

With the advent of greater levels of reporting (and being held to account for performance through the statistics thus produced) it fuels another phenomenon. There has never been more competition in the media. Hundreds of TV and local radio stations all vying with each other, millions of websites and internet based media plus the traditional newspaper press competing in a state of frenzy for their slice of a finite advertising cake. How do the proprietors and editors of these media outlets raise their profile above the clamour? By the time honoured methods of hype, exageration and downright lies, bending statistics to suit their particular editorial stance - the worst of them playing on the fears, prejudices and ignorance of the man in the street to whip up a frenzy of public opinion to suit their circulation figures or political leanings

I agree at 100%.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 16:08   #3
ariel ariel is offline
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Jools
So all is well. things have never been better! I feel so much happier now. This is a wonderful bike club now we can all relax. The unprecedented levels of vicious crime is an invention of the journalists who write for the Daily Mail.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 16:15   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
Jools
So all is well. things have never been better! I feel so much happier now. This is a wonderful bike club now we can all relax. The unprecedented levels of vicious crime is an invention of the journalists who write for the Daily Mail.

Jesus! Talk about twisting Jools' words!

He was saying things back then were no different, there was still a lot of violence then as there is now. Only now it's more widely reported by more sensationalist media.

If you take it in that vein and read it again it might make more sense? I hope so.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 16:29   #5
ariel ariel is offline
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I was referring to the late forties and fifties young man. There was NOT the level of vicious crime that there is now and I don't need your guidance on what constitutes common sense.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 16:34   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
I was referring to the late forties and fifties young man. There was NOT the level of vicious crime that there is now and I don't need your guidance on what constitutes common sense.

Well go ahead and be an arrogant bell-end then, see if I care

Enjoy!
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 16:51   #7
ariel ariel is offline
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So because you don't agree with me I'm arrogant! TP I respect Jools' view of the world more than anyone else who posts on this board but on this topic I believe he is wrong.
I will not Harp on about it though.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 17:08   #8
TP TP is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
So because you don't agree with me I'm arrogant! TP I respect Jools' view of the world more than anyone else who posts on this board but on this topic I believe he is wrong.
I will not Harp on about it though.

No, you're twisting my words just as you did Jools'

You're post was arrogant because of the condescending manner in which you posted.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 17:04   #9
Tonio600 Tonio600 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
I was referring to the late forties and fifties young man. There was NOT the level of vicious crime that there is now and I don't need your guidance on what constitutes common sense.

It would be very interesting to know how the figures for life expectancy are calculated.

Because on one hand there is all of you saying the world has never been so black, and on the other hand there is all of us living longer and longer.

Obviously I do share TP's and Jools' opinions. Human beings are not worse than they've ever been. Each of our generations have seen murdered millions of us, it shows that we have always been that stupid. Sad, but comforting.
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Old 06-Dec-2006, 17:15   #10
Scooter916 Scooter916 is offline
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Well Enjoy the Uk thats my last word on this subject. I will Watch the uk go to **** on Sky news From my hammock in retirement heaven. The Uk has nothing to offer.. and that is said with a heavy heart from a guy who has fought for his country.
There is a lot more I would like to type but I could be labled "insulting" By the PC nutters that seem to be Living in this once great nation.
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